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Rejecting CPGBML's admission to the Communist International

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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 28 Jan 2008, 19:10
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Komsomol
Post 21 Apr 2012, 02:39
I read this article a few years back, and thought it might shed light on some of the discussions here at S-E on the current state of the international communist movement and on the need for a new comintern. International Conference of Communist and Workers' Parties (ICCWP) is the closest thing to a comintern that exists today. And I thought the debate on whether the CPGBML should be allowed to join would be of interest to us.

http://www.cpgb-ml.org/index.php?secNam ... ementId=16

The CPB which conducted the inquiry wrote:
What qualifies a party for membership of the International Conference of Communist and Workers Parties?

All existing member parties possess:

A living Communist tradition: a significant core of members deriving from communist parties formed within the period of the Third International.

A working class base: influence within the trade union movement and other mass democratic organisations of working people that enables the linking of immediate struggles to wider class alliances and an understanding of capitalist or imperialist state power.

An ability to develop Marxism in the circumstances of their country: a democratic process that can generalise this experience, draw lessons and creatively develop Marxist-Leninist practice through Congresses and programmatic documents.

Our conclusion is that the CPGB-ML does not possess these characteristics.

The CPGBML answered "Before proceeding with our detailed treatment of the CPB’s said report, let it be remarked in passing that it is a grotesquely bizarre procedure whereby our most deadly opponents are given the decisive say on whether or not our party be admitted into the ranks of the International Conference of Communist and Workers’ Parties."

Regardless of the larger points at hand, on one point at least I think CPGBML made a good point in their rebuttal

"The CPB, with characteristic selective amnesia, ‘forgot’ to make even a cursory reference to some of the most important facts and points of principle which have direct bearing on the question under consideration. First, the most important thing is not whether many or any of the members of the CPGB-ML had been members of the original CPGB (although some had been) for, after all, there were plenty of members of the original CPGB who became rotten to the core liberals, hundreds of whom went on to liquidate the CPGB, having condemned the Great Socialist October Revolution as “a mistake of historic proportions”. The important thing is whether the CPGB throughout its existence, as well as the parties such as the CPB and NCP, stayed loyal to the principles and traditions of the Communist International."

This ironically reminds me about debates between Catholics and Protestants on Apostolic Succession. The Catholic think that it is passed on like an inherited monarchy from Peter to the current Pope. The Protestants claim that true apostolic succession means staying true to the teachings and practices of the apostles. So IDK whether its that important whether a party can directly trace its' membership to the 3rd international.

Any thoughts?
Kamran Heiss
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 14 Jun 2013, 09:08
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Pioneer
Post 18 Jun 2013, 10:14
"
Quote:
This ironically reminds me about debates between Catholics and Protestants on Apostolic Succession. The Catholic think that it is passed on like an inherited monarchy from Peter to the current Pope. The Protestants claim that true apostolic succession means staying true to the teachings and practices of the apostles. So IDK whether its that important whether a party can directly trace its' membership to the 3rd international. "


Fair comment, dear Heiss. Dig a little deeper, Think you can't help agree that a Law Lecturer/Businessman/Great Helmsman of the British Working Class is at no loss for words.....ever. Nor CPGBML Central Committee Member Keith A Bennett http://the48groupclub.com/activities/

News and Activities
China CITIC Bank Meeting

On October 8th 2012 at KPMG Offices in Salisbury Square a meeting took place between senior executives of China CITIC Bank and some leading British business leaders, academics and politicians facilitated by The 48 Group Club. The China CITIC Bank executive delegation was lead by Su Guoxin, Executive Vice-President.

Representatives from British business leaders included Martin Lamb, CEO IMI, Lord Tim Clement-Jones, Deputy Chair of the All Parliamentary Party China Group, Mehmet Ogutcu, Chair of Global Rescources Corp/ Invensys Plc Advisory Board, Nigel Pridmore, Partner, Linklaters and Professor Zheng-Xiao Guo Pro Provost China, University College of London. KPMG was represented by two Partners, Giles Adams and Pendar Ostover.

Stephen Perry, Chair, Keith Bennett and Daniel Jacoel represented The 48 Group Club


""Harpal explained also that some western customers buy their first shawl out of fashionable desire but, with exposure to quality work, that desire can become a need. Once a person is hooked, he said, he can end up talking about pashmina as though it were a controlled substance. There is, he said, simply nothing that feels quite like it: The touch of pashmina on the skin creates a uniquely luxurious feeling of understated, gently sensual warmth."


http://marxistleninist.proboards.com/in ... &post=5141

http://www.global.cn/en/About/Management.htm
Keith Bennett
Vice Chairman
Mr. Keith Bennett studied Chinese History and Politics at London University's School of Oriental and African Studies (SOAS) and has more than 30 years experience of working in and with China and other Asian and emerging markets, giving him unique insights and access. He is a specialist in strategic economic and political trends and government and public relations. Besides advising Prime Ministers, government ministers, leading corporates and others in the UK, Europe, Asia, Africa, the Middle East and Caribbean, he has written and lectured extensively and edited weekly and daily newspapers with a focus on Asia.




Defeat capitalism by helping the capitalist to increased exploitation?
.... "Good Plan!!"
The world is riven by class — not race, gender, age or disability. There is only one human race, and any ideas that promote divisions between us do the work of capitalism.
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 143
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 14 Jun 2013, 09:08
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Pioneer
Post 30 Jun 2013, 07:28
Quote:
Any thoughts?


A number Heiss. Rejected by organized workers the efforts by the fabulously wealthy Brar clan and Bennett CPGBML to gain admittance, interests us but little. So many British financial shenanigans, much of which flies below the radar. Enough apparently is not obscured from public gaze. Witness the Westminster scandals. Riding two ponies in tandem may be OK at the circus--thrilling. For British workers, communist business folk in a M-L party, family on a central committee provokes both mockery and righteous indignation. What is more one does not have to dig too deep.

http://www.network54.com/Forum/393207/m ... ension+Pot

Brar a Law Lecturer can talk a good talk alright. Can anybody be persuaded to walk a good walk, with him, or his cronies. Cults rarely offer up their inner workings. People leaving and gossip, entertain as much as enlighten. "Would not touch them with a barge pole!" is an oft heard expression.
Last edited by dodger on 30 Jun 2013, 08:26, edited 2 times in total.
The world is riven by class — not race, gender, age or disability. There is only one human race, and any ideas that promote divisions between us do the work of capitalism.
Soviet cogitations: 12389
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 18 Apr 2010, 04:44
Ideology: None
Philosophized
Post 30 Jun 2013, 08:22
I don't know much about this party, but their bizarre closeness with modern China raises my eyebrow. And what the hell is this "Pashmina"? Is Bennett looking to profit from increased commerce with China?

I'd have to say the "apostolic inheritance" business has some validity within religious tradition. But politics is the art of the possible, in the present tense, and such squabbling over inheritance is a massive waste of time. Better to have a brand new party that accomplishes things than an obsolete, hide bound, bunch of old sectarian fogies that accomplishes nothing.
Miss Strangelove: "You feed giants laxatives so goblins can mine their poop before the gnomes get to it."
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 14 Jun 2013, 09:08
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Pioneer
Post 30 Jun 2013, 09:00
Comrade Gulper wrote:
I don't know much about this party, but their bizarre closeness with modern China raises my eyebrow. And what the hell is this "Pashmina"? Is Bennett looking to profit from increased commerce with China?

I'd have to say the "apostolic inheritance" business has some validity within religious tradition. But politics is the art of the possible, in the present tense, and such squabbling over inheritance is a massive waste of time. Better to have a brand new party that accomplishes things than an obsolete, hide bound, bunch of old sectarian fogies that accomplishes nothing.


Apologies, Gulper, link was lame. Pashmina which Brar speaks about with such enthusiasm is his business. A new link:

http://www.saudiaramcoworld.com/issue/2 ... shmere.htm

http://howtospendit.ft.com/gift-guide/5 ... ere-shawls

You make fair comment, Comrade Gulper,,,,with investments in China and further afield no CPGBML view would be allowed to rock the Imperial Barge, methinks.

http://companycheck.co.uk/director/905455348

They still have time to write reams about British Labour Aristocracy and "crumbs".....though not their own "little" Gateaux.....
The world is riven by class — not race, gender, age or disability. There is only one human race, and any ideas that promote divisions between us do the work of capitalism.
Soviet cogitations: 12389
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 18 Apr 2010, 04:44
Ideology: None
Philosophized
Post 30 Jun 2013, 09:46
There are a few slightly dodgy Communist parties in the United States. But, since none of them are in a position to attract any serious international notice, they seem to be somewhat safeguarded against becoming mere pitchmen for Chinese imperialistic commercial ventures. Obviously, the situation in Europe and Sudamerica is different. I sincerely hope none of the major Communist or Socialist parties in these lands is guilty of such pandering. It seems one must be ever vigilant to spot such misdeeds.
Miss Strangelove: "You feed giants laxatives so goblins can mine their poop before the gnomes get to it."
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 22 Oct 2004, 15:15
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Politburo
Post 30 Jun 2013, 09:54
Pashmina refers to a sort of cashmere wool from India and the shawls made from it. Harpal Brar apparently runs a business selling them. It's expensive stuff. I don't really see how it's relevant to the party in this case, though. Brar doesn't try to conceal this fact about his life and, as far as I know, the business doesn't depend on the suppression of labour rights, sweatshop labour, or anything like that. I also don't think it has anything to do with China, but whatever.

To get to the meat of it: I don't think the meetings described here are "the Communist International", nor do they purport to be anything like it. In many countries, the communist movement is still hopelessly fragmented disorientated. Just look at Britain. It's a difficult situation, and I can imagine that it's "unfair" that "competing" parties of the CPGB-ML get a voice in their participation in these meetings, but the criteria for membership that the CPB describes seems sensible to me, and I also wonder whether the CPGB-ML meets these.

Even though, when you look at the CPGB-ML's website, it becomes obvious that they're more than just a bunch of Stalin nostalgics, I think it's also obvious that their main focus does seem to be theoretical "purity", judgements on history, class-free geopolitics, and sniping at those parts of the labour movement that do not match up to their idea of purity.

Hey, at least Harpal still gets to go to the Belgian seminars.
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 143
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 14 Jun 2013, 09:08
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Pioneer
Post 01 Jul 2013, 06:50
Hey, at least Harpal still gets to go to the Belgian seminars.


and..............

Keith Bennett still has an "open sezamee!" too:



Mr Keith Bennett provides secretariat services in a personal capacity to the group, free of charge.

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/p ... -korea.htm

Nearer home, it must be said....though both have the most enormous tentacles...."Yes and lined with suckers!!" As someone once quipped.
The world is riven by class — not race, gender, age or disability. There is only one human race, and any ideas that promote divisions between us do the work of capitalism.
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Jul 2013, 14:05
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New Comrade (Say hi & be nice to me!)
Post 26 Jul 2013, 14:56
"A working class base: influence within the trade union movement and other mass democratic organisations of working people that enables the linking of immediate struggles to wider class alliances and an understanding of capitalist or imperialist state power."

Please don't even try to suggest we don't have working class folk in our party...

"old sectarian fogies that accomplishes nothing."

Our party has one of the youngest set of people out there, over this past year the amount of youth who have joined our party has been great. In the NW branch have only a few over the age of 30 everyone else is young!

Sectarian? You clear don't look at what campaigns we are involved in then....
Please take a look on facebook we have a shed load of pictures on there of our activity with other groups ect.

Most recently organising an anti fascist protest in Leigh(Wigan)which we have invited everyone to, local people, SWP, UNITE ect ect
Unlike UAF who have to say that the protest was organised by them to give them some sort of fame, we haven't even mentioned that it is organised by CPGB-ML members.

Some of your accusations are pathetic, the party has grown nicely over the last year and got involved in many different campaigns, maybe if you took a look at some of our work and stop trying to slag the party off at every opportunity you have you would learn something. Your criticism of harpal is for having family members on the CC? and your problem with that is?

>Describes group as sectarian
>Wants to exclude it from local and international organisation

May I ask did you even bother reading
the reply the party gave

Edit: Read the forum rules. Don't double post. - Che B.
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 14 Jun 2013, 09:08
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Pioneer
Post 01 Aug 2013, 08:24
Quote:
CPGB-ML What a waste of time!!December 10 2012 at 11:21 PM

Hi Comrades,

I am new on here althrough Ive really enjoyed reading these forums for a while now.
I am a former member of the CPGB-ML (Im ashamed to say)I was a member for a few years and thought highly of them,now I see them for the joke and waste of time they really are.Infact I actually now dislike them.

Nothing is done on a UK basis.Dispite the hardship workers and the unemployed are facing in this country.Yet nothing at all is mentioned by the CPGB-ML,all they care about is Palestine.They must have some kind of fetish with this as it seems its all they go on about.
This constant fetish with the Middle East including dictatorships and supporting anybody who is anti-imperialist has lost them alot of members.
I hear from comrades still in the party,that alot have left and at this years Oct Rev event it seems more empty seats at Southall,and for the last few years guests from outside the party to speak at this event has fell so rapidly that I hear only speakers from inside the ranks of the CPGB-ML at this years Oct Rev event had took part.Also no videos been put up of the event on the Youtube channel they have.Where before this has been done for years.

They an absolute joke,and nearly made me lose my faith in Communism.Im glad to say my faith is restored and I look forward to the CPGB-ML getting even more members leaving.Its a pathetic excuse for a party.Wish I never been involved with them.

Lastly I agree with alot of views on here on Harpal Brar.The man is a capitalist businessman posing as a Communist! What a complete joke he and his family are.

Thanks for reading!
DotCommunist.
****************************************************************************************

http://www.network54.com/Forum/393207/t ... time%21%21

Seems DotCommunist view from the inside differs considerably from the rose tinted picture usually on offer. Well he/she is outside now, at least somewhat the wiser for the experience. Now so are we(wiser).
The world is riven by class — not race, gender, age or disability. There is only one human race, and any ideas that promote divisions between us do the work of capitalism.
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Soviet cogitations: 9
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Jul 2013, 14:05
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New Comrade (Say hi & be nice to me!)
Post 01 Aug 2013, 10:40
I would love to know who this really was.

Our party has grown very nicely over the last few months, bigger than its ever been.
We dont talk about British issues?
Haha! We are very active in the NHS & Bedroom tax campaigns, this really does show how much you idiots know about the party.
GO ON THE RED YOUTH BLOG
On there it shows all our activity, or visit us on Facebook and take a look at our Bedroom tax and NHS involvement.

It annoys me that you so called communist have to turn to petty political bitching about parties and out right slandering.
Most of which is lies and not backed up by any evidence except some guy who didn't like the party because it was "obsessed with Palestine" Well I advise his to stay away from the Palestine Solidarity Campaign they are always banging on about Palestine.

EDIT* I know who wrote this now, and she cant even talk about if Harpal has so much money or what ever, she off flying all over the world nearly every month, she not exactly one of the working class crying out because they have no job or been hit by the bedroom tax.
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Loz
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 06 Dec 2009, 23:17
Philosophized
Post 01 Aug 2013, 11:30
CPGBML is widely regarded as a joke. No offense but i get the impression that the party is funded by the Chinese state, and Harpal is noted for his pro-Chinese positions and supporting all kinds of reactionary dictatorships. It's especially ridiculous and absurd for self-proclaimed MLs to support the Chinese Comparty and their policies and even regard the PRC as socialist. China is an imperialist superpower and CPC is the enemy of all progressive forces in the world.
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 14 Jun 2013, 09:08
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Pioneer
Post 01 Aug 2013, 13:24
Quote:
China CITIC Bank Meeting

On October 8th 2012 at KPMG Offices in Salisbury Square a meeting took place between senior executives of China CITIC Bank and some leading British business leaders, academics and politicians facilitated by The 48 Group Club. The China CITIC Bank executive delegation was lead by Su Guoxin, Executive Vice-President.

Representatives from British business leaders included Martin Lamb, CEO IMI, Lord Tim Clement-Jones, Deputy Chair of the All Parliamentary Party China Group, Mehmet Ogutcu, Chair of Global Rescources Corp/ Invensys Plc Advisory Board, Nigel Pridmore, Partner, Linklaters and Professor Zheng-Xiao Guo Pro Provost China, University College of London. KPMG was represented by two Partners, Giles Adams and Pendar Ostover.

Stephen Perry, Chair, Keith Bennett and Daniel Jacoel represented The 48 Group Club

The meeting was very cordial and open discussions and dialogue took place around current developments in China, exploring services that CITIC Bank offered globally and highlighting the work UK companies were undertaking in China. Su Guoxin stressed that China CITIC Bank was growing rapidly in support of China’s rapidly growing globalisation and that they were considering the feasibility of setting up an office in London.


Hands Off China----could we have Hands off Britain? Hint--the chap who is second on the left also plays the "old geezer embarking on class warfare in the video so kindly provided above. Great performances!! Bouquet to KEITH BENNET--CC MEMBER CPGBML

Image


Loz 'fraid I know nothing of CPGBML relations with Chinese state if I was a member I would certainly make it my business to find out. What could a rich capitalist who claims to be a communist have in common with a society that claims to be socialist but has more and more millionaires? I'll have to think about that one.
The world is riven by class — not race, gender, age or disability. There is only one human race, and any ideas that promote divisions between us do the work of capitalism.
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 143
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 14 Jun 2013, 09:08
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Pioneer
Post 02 Aug 2013, 09:10
The Fellowship presentations -sponsored this year by KPMG - will be made by
Chinese Ambassador HE Madam Fu Ying and will take place at the Chinese Embassy in
London. Speakers will include: Madam Fu Ying, Lord McNally, Lord Davies, Stephen
Perry and Keith Bennett, Awards Chairman of the 48 Group Club.

At the event the 48 Club will also inaugurate nine new Honorary Members: Katie
Lee, Director of the Great Britain China Centre; Madeleine Sturrock, Managing Director
of PanCathay Consulting; Chris Yang, Chief Executive Officer of Newland UK Ltd; Sun
Jinhai, Chinese footballer with the Chendu Blades Club; Merlene Emerson, Lib-Dem
Parliamentary Candidate for Hammersmith; George Lee, Conservative Parliamentary
Candidate for Holborn & St Pancras; Professor Robin Porter, Visiting Professor at the
Centre for East Asian Studies, Unversity of Bristol; Professor Don Rimmington,
Emeritus Professor at the University of Leeds; and Stewart Yip, Chairman of Chi Yip

Madam Fu Ying, who studied at Kent University, commented: “The ChinaBritain relationship is one of the warmest of our external ties, and both sides have great
enthusiasm for economic and trade cooperation.”
Tony Blair said: “I am honoured to become a Fellow of the 48 Group Club. I
would like to congratulate the Club for its excellent work in helping to develop positive
relations with China.”

Stephen Perry added: “The Group demonstrated from the outset how closely it
would follow and seek to understand China’s developments. In this way it would try to
match China’s development needs by introducing relevant British companies and their
products to the market.

“As a result, Britain and the 48 Group earned a special place in the annals of
international trade history - and the UK became the first western country to open trade
with the new China on a platform of mutual respect.
“We continue to follow that philosophy and the Club offers an important and
often key network of contacts to those active in the China trade. It organises activities
throughout the UK, as well as taking part in academic and cultural exchanges,” he added.

http://www.the48groupclub.com/PDFs/Fell ... 202009.pdf

**********************************************

Did you get an invite, gazbamber?--mine got lost n the post......I know!!,,,"Party For Your Future"

[quote]A message for the young, for the old and for our future.[/quote]

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:Fill your glasses...comrade gentlemen and ladies....The Victorious Proletariat!!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Es8p3lsEgJc
The world is riven by class — not race, gender, age or disability. There is only one human race, and any ideas that promote divisions between us do the work of capitalism.
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 758
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 28 Jan 2008, 19:10
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Komsomol
Post 02 Aug 2013, 16:39
Just for clarification, both the Communist Party of Britain and the New Communist Party of Britain, the two parties which rejected CPGBML's application also support the current Chinese Regime. So I doubt support for Dengism was in anyway relevant.
Kamran Heiss
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