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NAZBOL political programme

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Soviet cogitations: 4465
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 30 Mar 2010, 01:20
Ideology: None
Forum Commissar
Post 19 Sep 2010, 11:21
Fellow Comrade wrote:
Our latest MTW is at least civil. And occasionally, I agree with him.
Rather good manners for what that's worth. It seems much easier to consider somebody's points of view if they're not hurling insults all around the place.
I still don't really get the logic of these nationalist socialist movements. How can any serious political ideology stop at a geographical border or at some racial definition?
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Soviet cogitations: 4501
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 07 Oct 2004, 22:04
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Resident Soviet
Post 19 Sep 2010, 22:09
Shigalyov wrote:
I still don't really get the logic of these nationalist socialist movements. How can any serious political ideology stop at a geographical border or at some racial definition?


In Russia I think this phenomenon can be explained (at least to some degree) by many Russian nationalist socialists' assertion that socialism, or at least many of its components, is a natural condition for Russians as a nation. They assert that the reason that capitalism has not worked in Russia is because the Russian mentality and soul is not destined for it. This national affinity to the ideals of socialism is based, according to them, on the history of Russian people, and their history of collectivism for example, and the distinct nature of the Russian Orthodox Church's teaching (which differ significantly from individualist protestantism and the alternative Catholicism). The importance of religion has been used by scholars like Max Weber to discuss different nations' comfort in capitalism:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Protestant_Ethic_and_the_Spirit_of_Capitalism

I have found myself agreeing with these Russian nationalists to a degree. Their conception is that socialism is good or natural for Russia, and thus whatever it is other countries and peoples want to do, Russia should go on the path of socialism. This feeling may have arisen in part out of the hurt Russians felt when some former Soviet or Eastern Bloc peoples (especially Poles, Balts) talk about the Russians imposing their system upon them. And certainly if there is no permanent 'nature' to any nation, the Russians -and most Soviet peoples, did come to have absorb morals, expectations, and attitudes opposed to the principles of capitalism over the seventy year period of socialism, at least.
"The thing about capitalism is that it sounds awful on paper and is horrendous in practice. Communism sounds wonderful on paper and when it was put into practice it was done pretty well for what they had to work with." -MiG
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Soviet cogitations: 4465
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 30 Mar 2010, 01:20
Ideology: None
Forum Commissar
Post 20 Sep 2010, 05:29
soviet78 wrote:
Their conception is that socialism is good or natural for Russia, and thus whatever it is other countries and peoples want to do, Russia should go on the path of socialism.
Does this mean that they don't worry about whether Socialism comes to other countries as well? Do they feel that their Socialist state would be vulnerable to threats from Imperialist states outside of themselves (just like last time)? Or do they hope that national military strength alone will protect them from this?
Isn't that the conventional socialist wisdom when it comes to imperialism? That imperialism is ultimately insatiable.
Soviet cogitations: 12389
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 18 Apr 2010, 04:44
Ideology: None
Philosophized
Post 20 Sep 2010, 06:10
I suppose this new Russian nationalist-socialism means "Socialism for Russia and Russia alone", with no further intention of expansion, and no attempt to reclaim the former USSR territories (Ukraine, the Stanleys, etc.). So there would presumably be no conflict with the rest of the world or the US in particular, as long as Russia kept to its own borders and its own affairs.

Incidentally, the more I think about it, the more I think an ideology of strictly "American Socialism" might be right for the US as well, at least until the transition to Socialism has completely cured it of its rampant imperialist urges.
Miss Strangelove: "You feed giants laxatives so goblins can mine their poop before the gnomes get to it."
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Soviet cogitations: 4779
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 12 May 2010, 07:43
Ideology: Other Leftist
Politburo
Post 20 Sep 2010, 06:28
Shigalyov wrote:
Does this mean that they don't worry about whether Socialism comes to other countries as well? Do they feel that their Socialist state would be vulnerable to threats from Imperialist states outside of themselves (just like last time)? Or do they hope that national military strength alone will protect them from this?
Isn't that the conventional socialist wisdom when it comes to imperialism? That imperialism is ultimately insatiable.


Order227 wrote:
I suppose this new Russian nationalist-socialism means "Socialism for Russia and Russia alone", with no further intention of expansion, and no attempt to reclaim the former USSR territories (Ukraine, the Stanleys, etc.). So there would presumably be no conflict with the rest of the world or the US in particular, as long as Russia kept to its own borders and its own affairs.


Perhaps they feel that they have the means and resources to stand up to capitalist imperialist aggression (Russia is the largest country in the world, after all). Either that, or they hope to eventually become a model for like-minded (most likely non-Western) peoples to follow, but without forcing it upon them to avoid creating resentment, so that there would be a bloc that could sustain itself and deter imperialist interference.

This is only my speculation, of course. I went back and read the party programs (both the older one in Dagoth's original post and the updated one posted by Papergut in Dec 2007), and their concerns do not seem to extend beyond Russia and her "Near Abroad."

EDIT: Didn't Moris post links to sites that had information on some National Bolshevik groups? Does anyone remember where he posted them or what those sites were?
“Conservatism is the blind and fear-filled worship of dead radicals” - Mark Twain
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