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Libya

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Soviet cogitations: 1533
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 10 Oct 2007, 15:55
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Party Member
Post 11 Oct 2007, 13:21
How is Libya a socialist state?
We have beaten you to the moon, but you have beaten us in sausage making.- Nikita Khrushchev
Soviet cogitations: 216
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 27 Nov 2006, 19:28
Pioneer
Post 11 Oct 2007, 15:08
It's not
“The question of the relationships between the party, which represents the proletariat as it should be, and the trade unions, which represent the proletariat as it is, is the most fundamental question of revolutionary Marxism.”
—Trotsky
Soviet cogitations: 1533
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 10 Oct 2007, 15:55
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Party Member
Post 11 Oct 2007, 15:20
In Wikipedia it says Libya's full title is Great Socialist People's Libyan Arab Jamahiriya.
We have beaten you to the moon, but you have beaten us in sausage making.- Nikita Khrushchev
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Soviet cogitations: 2880
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 16 Nov 2005, 17:55
Party Bureaucrat
Post 12 Oct 2007, 02:47
Calling oneself socialist doesn't make that person a socialist.
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"History is a set of lies agreed upon."
--Napoleon Bonaparte
Soviet cogitations: 1533
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 10 Oct 2007, 15:55
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Party Member
Post 12 Oct 2007, 03:21
Thus why I asked how is it socialist.
We have beaten you to the moon, but you have beaten us in sausage making.- Nikita Khrushchev
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Soviet cogitations: 10461
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 19 Aug 2006, 17:42
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
R.I.P.
Post 12 Oct 2007, 07:33
don't always believe what wiki states...

by that definition, china is still a communist country.

also, according to the Socialist International 1/3 of the world is under socialist rule..
Soviet cogitations: 1533
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 10 Oct 2007, 15:55
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Party Member
Post 12 Oct 2007, 13:03
Hopefully soon it will be...
We have beaten you to the moon, but you have beaten us in sausage making.- Nikita Khrushchev
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Soviet cogitations: 989
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 05 Jul 2004, 01:47
Komsomol
Post 12 Oct 2007, 23:49
Quote:
don't always believe what wiki states...


In this case though Wiki is basically right, that's what Libya is officially called. A name every bit as pompous and weird as Gaddhafi himself.
Soviet cogitations: 72
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 11 Jan 2007, 01:25
Pioneer
Post 25 Feb 2008, 07:10
Arright, I know this topic's pretty old, but I'm bored and I feel like putting some of my random knowledge of Libya to use.

Libya isn't "socialist" per se in that it's got a substantial private sector economy (considerably moreso now after their improvement of relations with the US), however, it is pretty "left" as far as government fiscal programs go; Ghadaffi actually puts most of the country's oil revenue into building a decent welfare state rather than spending it on palaces and hotels a la the Saudi royal family. As a result, Libya has the highest standard of living on continental Africa; a lot of workers from other, supposedly more "democratic" African countries immigrate there because they'll at least have a materially secure existence, a chance for a better education, etc.

At one point, Ghadaffi actually encouraged workers in certain sectors of the economy to seize control of the means of production from their managers, and they did. I'm not sure if this is still in force, but it's damned impressive considering that it almost never happens even in socialist countries. Also, I think there's generally full employment and people don't have to work overly hard at their job, at least in the nationalized sectors.

Ghadaffi's still a dictator, though. there's lots of bureaucratic corruption and you can't say or do a lot to criticize the government; also, one of the most notorious things about the country is that there is absolutely nothing to do in public on your free time. Ghadaffi's really big on Islamic austerity and thinks pleasure is evil or something, so there's no organized leisure activity or public entertainment. My friends who have been to Malta say it's always full of Libyans going on day-trips because it's so damn boring in Libya.
Soviet cogitations: 6887
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 30 Nov 2007, 08:37
Unperson
Post 25 Feb 2008, 11:13
The main problem is that their economies basis is still oil.
Soviet cogitations: 72
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 11 Jan 2007, 01:25
Pioneer
Post 25 Feb 2008, 13:25
yeah, they've got the same problem as Venezuela. oil prices go down enough, you're pretty much screwed because your economy just isn't diversified beyond that one commodity.
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Soviet cogitations: 716
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 04 Aug 2007, 23:25
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Komsomol
Post 18 Jun 2008, 20:33
Jamahiriyya means "government by the masses": political parties don't exist and every important decision is made by People Councils.
I'm about to read Chadaffi's Green Book (at least the English translation of it I found on the internet), and it seems a nice ideology to me.
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"Communism is more about love for mankind than about politics."
Me
Soviet cogitations: 3448
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Jun 2006, 15:59
Ideology: Other Leftist
Party Bureaucrat
Post 18 Jun 2008, 20:52
The Green Book is definatly an interesting read, its the perfect example of how a perfect sounding ideal, in the absense of a materialist theory of revolution, will fail to lead to real substained change.
The moment one accepts the notion of 'totalitarianism', one is firmly locked within the liberal-democratic horizon. - Slavoj Žižek
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Soviet cogitations: 716
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 04 Aug 2007, 23:25
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Komsomol
Post 19 Jun 2008, 13:29
It's indeed very ideological, maybe even idealistic.
That's why Chadaffi ends with: "In theory this is genuine democracy, but in practice it's always the strongest who rules."
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"Communism is more about love for mankind than about politics."
Me
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Soviet cogitations: 716
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 04 Aug 2007, 23:25
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Komsomol
Post 27 Sep 2008, 08:28
But nevertheless i support Libya.
It's another system, but it works.
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"Communism is more about love for mankind than about politics."
Me
Soviet cogitations: 3448
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Jun 2006, 15:59
Ideology: Other Leftist
Party Bureaucrat
Post 27 Sep 2008, 15:31
a double post and necro-post with nothing to add... why?
The moment one accepts the notion of 'totalitarianism', one is firmly locked within the liberal-democratic horizon. - Slavoj Žižek
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 258
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 03 Oct 2009, 17:50
Komsomol
Post 19 Oct 2009, 15:48
I like the anti-imperialist role of the Lybian Revolution and the elements of socialism, though non-Marxist, in it. But I dislike the Lybian policies towards the migrants and refugees, mostly from from Subsaharan Africa, that try to come to Italy by boat and are pushed back to Lybia, where they are tortured by the police and carried through the desert on trucks given to Lybia by Italy, supplied with a good stock of corpse bags, which show that the two governments know what will happen, and is happening, to those people that tried to flee wars, hunger, death. The alliance between Italy and the neo-servile Lybian government is so negative that it tremendously outweighs what I consider good in Lybian politics.
If you tremble at the slightest indignation done to a fellow human, then you are my comrade-in-arms. Commander E. Guevara de la Serna
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