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Bolivarian Revolution (The New Sub-Subforum of Venezuela)

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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 12 Jun 2006, 02:14
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Politburo
Post 20 Oct 2009, 04:11
Quote:
The 2002 coup was run by the government itself

And so was 9/11...
wow..
tinfoil hat time!


Sorry, tried to watch the video but it seemed too similar to Globovision.

Quote:
And the Caracazo was caused by rising gas and public transport prices

That was the inmediate cause, but the underlying cause lied in the neoliberal measures taken by Carlos Andres Perez, and suggested by the IMF, that included the elimination of fuel subsidies. The neoliberal agenda was exactly that, transfer all the loses brought by the crisis in capitalism to the poor classes.


"Where Argentina goes, Latin America will go".
Leonid Brezhnev

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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 13 Oct 2009, 07:01
Pioneer
Post 20 Oct 2009, 05:13
Oh, I'm not saying I disagree with that last bit about the Caracazo, since you can't exactly say that CAP did a good job. All I'm trying to argument here is that Chávez is trying to avoid recreating that direct cause again, and as such applies economic measures that would make no sense anywhere else.

Also, watch that video through. I know it might sound a lot like Globovisión, but just try. Trust me, you're going to get at least something out of it.
Soviet cogitations: 495
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 03 Mar 2008, 02:36
Komsomol
Post 20 Oct 2009, 06:22
The coup was orcestrated by the government? Okay. I've got to agree with Che about the tinfoil hat.

So strange that only a few people know about it! Only a few can see the truth!
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 13 Oct 2009, 07:01
Pioneer
Post 20 Oct 2009, 20:39
So few people? Hmph, yeah right. Go ahead and ask most people over here. They'll agree one of two things: Either that it was orchestrated by the government or that, at the very least, the opposition was not behind the leaving of Chávez for a day.

Alright. All of you already know that Chávez fired a lot of PDVSA management employees (middle-tier, below the members of the board but still powerful) on April 7th, 2002, which caused the protest on the 11th, gathering a rather gigantic concentration of opposition supporters at PDVSA Chuao, which then decided to go towards Miraflores (since they had such a large concentration) to try and attempt a coup on Chávez so that the members on the board in PDVSA (which were implanted by Chávez) would resign, and a new one be implanted. However, Chávez already had their resignation when the protest changed its course, and could have simply put that out in a nationally-televised speech (which is said by him in the first clip, a cadena made on April 14th, and the second, a clip of an interview with one of the army generals present during the coup), which would have led the manifestation maybe not to stop, but to start a celebration since they had already achieved what they were going for. So, why did Chávez deliberately create conflict? According to the third clip, a speech on January 1st, 2004, he says that he was already provoking the crisis when throwing the people out of PDVSA (which lead to the protests, which lead to his resignation for a day and then returning, which led eventually to the oil crisis later on), and that the crisis was "necessary". So, then, how was this not orchestrated by Chávez himself?

Here is the video proving the above. Only about 8 MB, WMV format.
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 21 Dec 2004, 23:53
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Philosophized
Post 21 Oct 2009, 18:01
Quote:
Venezuelan police told to shape up

The police in Venezuela are involved in 20% of all crimes committed in the country.

That startling admission was made by none other than the country's interior minister, Tarek El-Aissami.

For many Venezuelans, it was a surprisingly frank assessment of a problem which the the government has been accused of denying for years.

But there are now signs that, at an official level, the taboo about the state of the police is being broken.

"We know that part of the drama which our country is experiencing is because the majority of police agencies have been penetrated by criminal elements," Mr El-Aissami said at a recent police convention. "And that is simply intolerable."

The Venezuelan police are considered among the worst in Latin America in terms of corruption and violence.

"I would say they are a very similar phenomenon to the police in Rio de Janeiro or Central American countries such as El Salvador and Guatemala" says Venezuelan criminologist Andres Antillano.

"Such police forces were generally established during military regimes and are still seen by the state as an instrument of repression, of social control."
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"By what standard of morality can the violence used by a slave to break his chains be considered the same as the violence of a slave master?" - Walter Rodney
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 21 Dec 2004, 23:53
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Philosophized
Post 23 Oct 2009, 01:02
Comrade Rabbit wrote:
I haven't heard much about him. I know what he's done over here and the fact that he writes about Chávez's supposed socialism, but no idea about his actual ideas. Could you clear me up on that?


He is a social-democrat and I'm not a big fan of him. He is taking credit for creating the ideology of the Bolivarian Revoltion.

Comrade Rabbit wrote:
Also, all I can say is that, much as I disagree with the revolution, the one thing we have to do in this country is unite, rather than divide ourselves further.


That is really interesting. Many historians consider Venezeula's golden years where their were not class based politics between the 1950s through the 1980s (prior to neo-liberalism). Than with neo-liberalism and than with Chavez, Venezuela returned to class based politics (i.e. the rich vs. the poor).
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"By what standard of morality can the violence used by a slave to break his chains be considered the same as the violence of a slave master?" - Walter Rodney
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 13 Oct 2009, 07:01
Pioneer
Post 23 Oct 2009, 05:35
Verily. In fact, one can say that Venezuela's tangible "golden age" was during Pérez Jiménez. We had no debt, we were the second-most modern country in Latin America (second only to Cuba, and they were incredibly modernised since they were the US' brothel), with almost no unemployment, and the future looked very, very bright. Hell, in the end, when the protests got big, the man realised that the people didn't like him, and left them to fend off for themselves. The country didn't degrade much for a few more years, until the 70's. Then, Pérez Jiménez came back from Spain to run for president, and was outlawed from the country by Luis Herrera Cámpins, one of the most corrupt politicians in Venezuelan history. Who knows what we could have been, had they let Pérez Jiménez back in...

Anyway, my point still stands. The line between classes should be blurred with a socialist revolution, not made more striking with each passing day. This is precisely where Chávez messes up, though he seems to be doing it deliberately to create conflict - otherwise, he'd have closed Globovisión by now (which he perfectly can).
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 14 Jul 2008, 20:01
Ideology: Trotskyism
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Post 23 Oct 2009, 11:52
But conflict is needed. I can perfectly understand a strategy that is based on artifically fortifying class contradictions in order to fuel class struggle. Class contradictions need to be solved, not blurred.
"Don't know why i'm still surprised with this shit anyway." - Loz
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 13 Oct 2009, 07:01
Pioneer
Post 23 Oct 2009, 15:25
That is good in theory, but Chavez has been doing it for the past 7 years and it's only gotten worse. Unless he wants all the brains of the country to run away to Miami, he should probably start changing his strategy to something more sensible and fitting to the situation.
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 12 Jun 2006, 02:14
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Post 23 Oct 2009, 15:58
There are much more brains brewing now in the Bolivarian universities than there used to be before. If they want to run away to Miami, let them. The whole continent's scum lives there.


"Where Argentina goes, Latin America will go".
Leonid Brezhnev

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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 13 Oct 2009, 07:01
Pioneer
Post 23 Oct 2009, 16:07
What, when doctors and oil engineers and the like can graduate in three months? The quality of education has gone extremely downhill in the past 4 years or so. I haven't read Chavez's education law, but from what I've seen this might help to change that. We'll have to see.

And, well, I'm running off to Miami myself. I have my reasons, I've thought them over for the past year, I think I know what I'm doing. I feel like I have more of a chance over there.
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 03 Mar 2008, 02:36
Komsomol
Post 23 Oct 2009, 23:40
Have fun with the Cuban gusanos.
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 21 Dec 2004, 23:53
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Post 24 Jan 2010, 21:26
Quote:
Announcing Venezuela’s First and Only English Language Newspaper, Correo del Orinoco International

Published on January 22nd 2010, by Correo del Orinoco International
Caracas, January 22nd 2010 – This Friday, Venezuela celebrates the launching of its first and only English language newspaper, the Correo del Orinoco International. While in the past other English-language publications have existed, none remain in circulation today, and no others have been created during the Bolivarian Revolution.

Editor-in-Chief Eva Golinger explained, “This will be the first newspaper of its kind in Venezuela. We will produce news and information for an international audience, but from the Venezuelan perspective. Most of the news that’s out there in English comes from international news agencies that report with a biased perspective and tend to ignore important human interest stories that paint a positive picture of the Chávez government.”

“Our most important mission is to combat the massive media manipulation and information blockade against Venezuela and to inform the international community about many incredible events taking place daily inside Venezuela that rarely receive attention from the corporate media”, commented Golinger.

The original Correo del Orinoco was founded by Venezuela’s liberator, Simón Bolívar on June 27, 1818. It served as a principal source of information during the time of independence and the creation of the Venezuelan Republic. Bolívar encouraged writing and reporting as a form of “artillery”, termed by him as the “Artillery of Ideas”.

One hundred ninety one years later, the Correo del Orinoco in Spanish was relaunched as part of the Venezuelan people’s effort to combat corporate media misreporting and disinformation campaigns against the Venezuelan government and the Bolivarian Revolution, nationally and internationally. Today, the Correo del Orinoco is a widely-read and referenced daily paper, reporting on political, social, economic, judicial, cultural and international events of importance to the Venezuelan people, with a balanced and informative tone.

In times of Simón Bolívar, the Correo del Orinoco was published not only in Spanish, but also occasionally in English and French. Today this tradition is continued with the creation of the first foreign language version of the Correo del Orinoco International, a weekly paper in English for distribution nationally and internationally.

“Issues and stories of how social and economic justice are being built in Venezuela today will be our priority”, added the editor, Eva Golinger.

The Correo del Orinoco International will be available in print this Friday, January 22, and next Friday, January 29, as a free insert in the Spanish-language daily edition. The English-language paper will be formally launched as a separate publication on February 4, and then will be available every Friday at newstands across Venezuela. International distribution of the print edition is a future goal, but initially, it will be available in digital format on the Spanish-language website, also to be launched February 4.
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"By what standard of morality can the violence used by a slave to break his chains be considered the same as the violence of a slave master?" - Walter Rodney
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 11 Nov 2009, 07:13
Ideology: Other Leftist
Politburo
Post 26 Jan 2010, 00:53
Latin America is definetly the most prone region to revolution. They share a language, a background, and similar oppression. There is no doubt that the Bolivarian Revolution is approaching.
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 21 Dec 2004, 23:53
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Post 29 Jan 2010, 06:29
Quote:
The Washington Post “knocks” the Bolivarian Revolution

January 28th 2010, by Rafael Rico Rios – Rebelion

On 25 January 2010 the Washington Post published the article, ‘How Hugo Chavez’s revolution crumbled’ By Jackson Diehl, a writer for the Washington Post who specialises in international analysis. This article was published just before the terrible media storm unleashed by the case of the television channels [that were temporarily suspended]. A shame for the author because he might have had one more argument for his eager attempt to shoot down revolutions.

The first sentence of his analysis is blunt: “Hugo Chávez's "socialism for the 21st century" has been defeated and is on its way to collapse.”

In the face of a statement like that, one has no choice but to think that the analyst is going to reveal significant and undisputable information.

However, we’re already used to the commercial press and these types of analysts, and we quickly find what we had feared. The author discloses his political position with phrases such as this one:

“In Honduras, a seven-month crisis triggered by the attempt of a Chávez client to rupture the constitutional order quietly ended with a deal that will send him into exile even as a democratically elected moderate is sworn in as president.”

It doesn’t even deserve a comment.

He continues with the economic theme, something always fundamental for the commercial press. “The country reeled from recession, double-digit inflation and the possible collapse of the national power grid.” And he adds that, meanwhile, “a presidential election in Chile, the region's most successful economy, produced the first victory by a right-wing candidate”. It’s a typical comparison in Latin American of two models that have been at odds in recent years.

Checking over the statistics about the Chilean economy we can see that in 2009 they had a GDP drop of 1.9%, an unprecedented contraction since the crisis of 1982. The Chilean economy grew in 2008 by 3.2% while the Venezuelan economy grew by 4.8% in 2008.

So we don’t know exactly what successful economy the author is referring to. I imagine that what he is referring to is what is successful for the neoliberals, that is, for the rich and for the big international companies that can do and undo what they like with total “freedom” in Chile and without worrying about the injustice and misery that their model of development generates. The Bolivarian government reached, in the middle of a global crisis, the biggest drop in the inequality index in all of Latin America; the Gini index went down to 0.41.

And as always, the brainy analyst touches on the theme of human rights; “Piñera has now provided Washington an opportunity to raise its voice about Venezuelan human rights violations”.

And there we have the most qualified person to talk about human rights: Piñera, leader of the Chilean right, a right wing that has amongst its achievements in human rights, the 35,000 people who were victims of human rights violations; 28,000 tortured, 2,279 executed, and 1,248 remain disappeared.

The author insists on Honduras, and says that, “The outcome is a victory for the United States, which was virtually the only country that backed the democratic election that broke the impasse. Honduras is the end of Chávez's crusade to export his revolution to other countries.”

We can see that in the case of Honduras, human rights are not very important to the author. The fact that in Honduras there has been a coup d’etat, illegal raids, massive detentions, extrajudicial executions, and closure of media, isn’t important to the author, what’s important is ending “Chavez’s crusade”.

“Haiti only deepens Chávez's hole. As the world watches, the United States is directing a massive humanitarian operation, and Haitians are literally cheering the arrival of U.S. Marines.” Even the tragedy of an earthquake is a reason to support the argument that Chavez is on his way out. It’s difficult to follow the author’s logic, if he has any. Not coupes, nor disappearances, nor torture, nor assassinations, nor earthquakes, nor hunger, nor suffering, the only thing that seems important to this author is the crumbling of Chavez.

He returns to the economy: “Venezuelan economy is deep in recession and continues to sink even as the rest of Latin America recovers. Economists guess inflation could rise to 60 percent in the coming months.”

We don’t know which economists predicted an inflation of 60% and the sinking of the economy, we can imagine that they are the same economists who have spent the last 10 years announcing the fall of the Chavez government by economic collapse. However, in the last decade Venezuela has reached the highest economic figures in a long time, including the lowest inflation.

Referring to Haiti and Chavez’s comments on it, he adds that “his state television even claimed that the U.S. Navy caused the earthquake using a new secret weapon.”. He took this sentence from an opinion article published on the webpage of a public Venezuelan television channel. I suppose that, following the same logic, all the opinion published on public US television would be attributed to Obama.

And was expected from the beginning of the text, he had to cite a survey: “But Chavez's approval ratings are still sinking: They've dropped to below 50 percent in Venezuela and to 34 percent in the rest of the region.”

There are no references to what surveys say that. This 34% acceptance of Chavez in the rest of the region is interesting, taking into account the international media campaign. However, in Chile there’s no voting where the Chileans can elect the president of Venezuela. The important elections are the national ones, and just a few weeks ago the most serious polling agencies have found that Chavez has a high level of popularity, enough to comfortably win the presidential elections again.

Either way, the Venezuelan people have the last say, despite how the analyst of the Washington Post doesn’t believe in them much, and until now, Chavez has easily won all the elections in which he has been a candidate.

The article ends with a brilliant statement: “But the turning point in the battle between authoritarian populism and liberal democracy in Latin America has passed -- and Chávez has lost.” Without arguments…and without comments.

Translated by Tamara Pearson for Venezuelanalysis.com


All the quotes in the original article were italicized, too lazy to go through the article and do that. But Venezeula Analysis does do a rather good job at countering the Washington Post's propaganda.
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"By what standard of morality can the violence used by a slave to break his chains be considered the same as the violence of a slave master?" - Walter Rodney
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 15 Jan 2010, 05:28
Komsomol
Post 30 Jan 2010, 05:22
Good post, Red Rebel, The New York Times is probably even worse when it comes to Chavez. They've predicted his imminent demise several times now since 2002. First it was the coup, then it was the election of Naboa in Peru, then it was Uribe's popularity in Colombia, then it was Calderon winning in Mexico, and so on...In fact, during the 2002 coup they even printed a headline that said (I kid you not) "Down with Populism, Up With The Military"(I cut this out and it is still taped on my wall lol!). You would have to go back to Francoist Spain to see anti-democratic propaganda that blatant.
"I am not the champion of lost causes, but the champion of causes not yet won."-Norman Thomas
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 07 Jul 2006, 04:49
Ideology: Juche
Old Bolshevik
Post 30 Jan 2010, 10:33
Quote:
In fact, during the 2002 coup they even printed a headline that said (I kid you not) "Down with Populism, Up With The Military"(I cut this out and it is still taped on my wall lol!). You would have to go back to Francoist Spain to see anti-democratic propaganda that blatant.


And some people seem to wonder why I have no respect for the Western Corporate Media!
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 08 Nov 2007, 06:31
Embalmed
Post 30 Jan 2010, 21:06
red tom you should post a pic
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 21 Dec 2004, 23:53
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Philosophized
Post 30 Jan 2010, 21:50
Wow I just read the article from the 13th of April 2002.

Also here is the pic: Link.
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"By what standard of morality can the violence used by a slave to break his chains be considered the same as the violence of a slave master?" - Walter Rodney
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 19 Mar 2005, 20:08
Embalmed
Post 30 Jan 2010, 21:56
Classy, New York Times. Both figuratively and literally.
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"Bleh, i don't even know what i'm arguing for. What a stupid rant. Disregard what i wrote." - Loz
"Every time is gyros time" - Stalinista
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