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Warsaw pact and satellite states

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Soviet cogitations: 60
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 18 Dec 2004, 03:55
Pioneer
Post 20 Dec 2004, 06:21
Should a new soviet union reform the warsaw pact and the satellite states?
Most people talk, few are up for the moment.

"Let the red star shine brightly over Russia once again"

Ein schrei wird zum himmel fahren
schneidet sich durch engelscharen
vom wolkendach fallt federfleich
auf meine kindheit mit gekreich.
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Soviet cogitations: 1019
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 16 Dec 2004, 21:30
Party Member
Post 20 Dec 2004, 10:29
How? And with who?


All important Warsaw Pact countries have joined NATO
Even Warsaw itself is at NATO-country


East-Germany joinden west-germany (and NATO as well). Poland, Baltic countries, Czech rep, Hungary, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia and Bulgaria all joined NATO.

So from old Warsaw pact members there is only Albania left and some former Soviet Union States like Belarussia.
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Soviet cogitations: 634
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 12 Aug 2004, 22:40
Komsomol
Post 20 Dec 2004, 14:21
Turhapuro wrote:
How? And with who?


All important Warsaw Pact countries have joined NATO
Even Warsaw itself is at NATO-country


East-Germany joinden west-germany (and NATO as well). Poland, Baltic countries, Czech rep, Hungary, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia and Bulgaria all joined NATO.

So from old Warsaw pact members there is only Albania left and some former Soviet Union States like Belarussia.


Haha so Warsaw is a country suddenly?
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Soviet cogitations: 1019
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 16 Dec 2004, 21:30
Party Member
Post 20 Dec 2004, 15:21
Thien_Thai wrote:
Haha so Warsaw is a country suddenly?

No, it is Polands capital city. Why? I said Warsaw is at NATO-country.

Next time read more carefully before trying to joke
Soviet cogitations: 60
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 18 Dec 2004, 03:55
Pioneer
Post 21 Dec 2004, 18:26
Russia needs a new revolution and I just wanted some opinions. I havent been reading up on it but the last time I checked France pulled out of NATO are they still out?
Most people talk, few are up for the moment.

"Let the red star shine brightly over Russia once again"

Ein schrei wird zum himmel fahren
schneidet sich durch engelscharen
vom wolkendach fallt federfleich
auf meine kindheit mit gekreich.
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 1019
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 16 Dec 2004, 21:30
Party Member
Post 22 Dec 2004, 17:03
Vladimir_lenin wrote:
Russia needs a new revolution

Russians don't revolt easily. Tou probably need new world war.
Soviet cogitations: 700
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 01 Jan 2005, 16:45
Komsomol
Post 02 Jan 2005, 19:56
I hate the nato.I hate the euro.
.But what do i know right i'm just some kid who did't even finish the 9 th grade and who wishes the soviet union would ressurect.
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When I was young
It seemed that life was so wonderful
A miracle
Oh it was beautiful
magical.
All the birds in the trees
They could sing so happily
So joyfully
Oh playfully watching me
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Soviet cogitations: 1702
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 21 Oct 2004, 21:15
Party Member
Post 02 Jan 2005, 21:25
Turhapuro wrote:
Russians don't revolt easily. Tou probably need new world war.

They revolt more easily than Westerners. They're much less complacent. Witness the American election two months ago. Highly questionable results, but Kerry concedes, and nothing happens.
Same thing happens during an election in Ukraine. Highly questionable results, and the capital becomes occupied by protesters, and the streets are barricaded!


frank_pivo_4 wrote:
I hate the nato.I hate the euro.
.But what do i know right i'm just some kid who did't even finish the 9 th grade and who wishes the soviet union would ressurect.

You have an open mind to history, and that's more than a lot of kids can say.
"Shake your chains to earth, like dew / Which in sleep had fall'n on you: / YE ARE MANY-THEY ARE FEW." - Percy Bysshe Shelley, 'The Masque of Anarchy'
Soviet cogitations: 700
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 01 Jan 2005, 16:45
Komsomol
Post 02 Jan 2005, 21:48
I love history, when i was little i was into animals and earth science , still am but i like history and geopgraphy more
.The thing is i just have a rough outline of the events i never really studied the details.
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When I was young
It seemed that life was so wonderful
A miracle
Oh it was beautiful
magical.
All the birds in the trees
They could sing so happily
So joyfully
Oh playfully watching me
Soviet cogitations: 28
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 01 Sep 2004, 19:44
Pioneer
Post 03 Jan 2005, 00:32
russia doesnt need communism...
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Soviet cogitations: 866
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 05 Mar 2003, 16:07
Komsomol
Post 03 Jan 2005, 18:53
One more refined statement by b.scheller!
I love your attitude. Yes, let them Russians die under capitalism, it's so humane...


Papergut wrote:
If you compare Stalin's USSR to Yeltsin's and Putin's Russia you will see that the effects of their reigns are completely opposite: during Stalin the country rapidly industrialized, the population continued to grow and all demographical characteristics had positive vector. Now Russia is deindustrialized, capitalist reforms and privatization caused more damage to the country's economy than the Great Fatherland War of 1941-1945. At peacetime Russia lost more people during last thirteen years than it lost during its bloodiest of wars.

There's a good proverb over here: "V Rossii net strashnej napasti, chem democrat, dorvavshijsja do vlasti" ("There is no bigger tragedy for Russia than a democrat who got power")...


Just mind your hockey and let us decide our future ourselves, horosho?
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Soviet cogitations: 9306
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 02 Mar 2004, 15:19
Ideology: Other Leftist
Old Bolshevik
Post 03 Jan 2005, 21:16
Turhapuro wrote:
No, it is Polands capital city. Why? I said Warsaw is at NATO-country.

Next time read more carefully before trying to joke :D


He got confused, cause that is terrible grammar, especially for a Finn. The correct word you were looking for, was in a NATO country.
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Fitzy wrote:
Yes, because I am poisoning them. They are my children.
Soviet cogitations: 60
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 18 Dec 2004, 03:55
Pioneer
Post 04 Jan 2005, 19:25
they do revolt easily i agree with the comment on the U.S elections and the ukraine elections. But what needs to be done is once the former ussr is restored split germany back up because it was russias smartest move because with germany split up their weaker. but has france re joined nato?
Most people talk, few are up for the moment.

"Let the red star shine brightly over Russia once again"

Ein schrei wird zum himmel fahren
schneidet sich durch engelscharen
vom wolkendach fallt federfleich
auf meine kindheit mit gekreich.
Nil
[+-]
Soviet cogitations: 224
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 18 Feb 2005, 19:15
Pioneer
Post 18 Feb 2005, 22:45
Vladimir_lenin wrote:
Should a new soviet union reform the warsaw pact and the satellite states?


No. First off, it would start a world war.

Second, the Soviets would lose.
Soviet cogitations: 1791
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 11 Dec 2004, 11:58
Party Member
Post 19 Feb 2005, 00:23
Quote:
No. First off, it would start a world war.


The Warsaw pact doesn't need to be reformed, as Russia is quite capable of taking America already.

Quote:
Quote:
Second, the Soviets would lose.


Wrong, either the Soviets would win, or they both would be destroyed.
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Nil
[+-]
Soviet cogitations: 224
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 18 Feb 2005, 19:15
Pioneer
Post 20 Feb 2005, 20:20
So most likely, both would be destroyed, because NATO would follow the same philosophy. If it went nuclear, everyone of us would be dead. No matter who launched first.

In a conventional war, at this point, Russia would be hard-pressed to fight off NATO, or just the United States. Russia doesn't have the forward deployment/buffer that they did when the Warsaw Pact was in-effect. Of course, the US/NATO doesn't quite have the same thing either, and at this point any one side invading the other would most likely be dragged out into a long conventional war with no quick ending. And that, my friend, is a war which nobody really wants to see. At least nobody sane.

But since the USA has no interest in invading Russia, it's a moot point to argue. And believe me, Russia and the US are allies now more than enemies.

Now, if Russia started trying to gobble up and control former Warsaw Pact nations (many of which are in NATO now) then there'd be war. A war in which Russia deserved to be invaded.

Why do you seem to want a USA/Russia confrontation? What would it solve? Things seem like they'd be better off with Russia and the USA as allies.
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Soviet cogitations: 1180
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 25 Jan 2005, 10:55
Party Member
Post 20 Feb 2005, 22:28
True, even if ideologies collide, it is always better for your people to cooperate than to constantly argue. You must always think of the people first, never yourself.
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“Patriotism is when love of your own people comes first; nationalism, when hate for people other than your own comes first.” - Charles De Gaulle
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Soviet cogitations: 10805
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 21 Dec 2004, 23:53
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Philosophized
Post 23 Feb 2005, 01:06
Quote:
Quote:
No. First off, it would start a world war.


The Warsaw pact doesn't need to be reformed, as Russia is quite capable of taking America already.

Quote:
Quote:
Second, the Soviets would lose.


Wrong, either the Soviets would win, or they both would be destroyed.


1. Russia is in no way, in its current state, able to take on the US.
2. Russia woulld lose or everyone would die (Russia would be defeated in both scenorios).
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"By what standard of morality can the violence used by a slave to break his chains be considered the same as the violence of a slave master?" - Walter Rodney
Soviet cogitations: 1791
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 11 Dec 2004, 11:58
Party Member
Post 23 Feb 2005, 01:20
Quote:
Now, if Russia started trying to gobble up and control former Warsaw Pact nations (many of which are in NATO now) then there'd be war. A war in which Russia deserved to be invaded.


It might cause a war, but Kazakhastan is becoming ever more intergrated into Russian society, perhaps they wish to merge with Russia, it would benifit there people, economy & military.

Quote:
Why do you seem to want a USA/Russia confrontation? What would it solve? Things seem like they'd be better off with Russia and the USA as allies.


Russian vs American confrontation [conventionally] would be endless, both have countless reserves [Russian has 20 million trained reservers, ready to be armed, i'm not to sure about America].

America does not have a 'technological gap' over Russia, they are equal, if the invasion into Russia was led by American tanks they would meat T-80U's and T-72B/etc which are perfect for fighing in Russian territory. Helicopters are equal, except in airforce, that is where the Russians are at a disadvantage, but in air defence they have the advantage, with a wide variety of man-portable AA weapons.

Quote:
1. Russia is in no way, in its current state, able to take on the US.


Ignorance is great, Russian army is more than capable of competing with the US, how do you see them unfit to? they are more than ready.

Quote:
2. Russia woulld lose or everyone would die .


No.Russian would not "lose". Everyone would die.

Quote:
(Russia would be defeated in both scenorios)


Why? because I know they won't, as do most people who know anything about Russian forces.
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Soviet cogitations: 10805
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 21 Dec 2004, 23:53
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Philosophized
Post 23 Feb 2005, 18:28
Nikita- I don't think I said this so when I said US I also ment their allies (in the UN), ie Great Britain, France Germany, ect.
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"By what standard of morality can the violence used by a slave to break his chains be considered the same as the violence of a slave master?" - Walter Rodney
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