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Top 5 mistakes the Soviet Union made.

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Soviet cogitations: 9816
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 19 Apr 2008, 03:25
Embalmed
Post 07 Feb 2009, 21:17
1. Sino-Soviet Split
2. De-Stalinization
3. Afghanistan
4. Backing down in the Cuban Missle Crissis
5. Gorbachev...need I say more?
Once capitalists know we can release the Kraken, they'll back down and obey our demands for sure.
_Comrade Gulper
Soviet cogitations: 6887
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 30 Nov 2007, 08:37
Unperson
Post 08 Feb 2009, 02:51
This thread is sort of pointless. The USSR was not a single entity, but a complex political structure with a multi-layered and multi-faceted decision-making structure. It becomes impossible to pin mistakes down on the country as a whole, not to mention that this simple listing of the mistakes with little if any actual debate is simple a postcount +1 type of thread.
banistansig1
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Soviet cogitations: 109
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 18 May 2009, 14:55
Pioneer
Post 19 May 2009, 05:34
Quote:
The number one mistake that led to the unions collapse must have been glasnost in my opinion. Perestroyka was a good idea given the stagnant economy but glasnost rendered the people to stop beeing afraid of the authoraties and that led to upraising I believe.
China however kept the system closed and and authoritarian but opened up the econamy (perestroyka but no glasnost) and they are still kicking.


Socialism isn't based on "fearing authorities." Glastnost was needed in the USSR, as Pravda was a joke, and the government hid too many things about the state of the nation from the people.

Perestroika on the other hand, was a disaster. Scrapping the planned economy was tossing the baby out with the bathwather.

My list of major mistakes:

1. Stalin's "purges"
2. Entering an arms race with the US
3. Invading Afghanistan
4. Perestroika
5. Letting morons like Brezhnev and Gorbachev run the CPSU
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Soviet cogitations: 5146
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 08 Nov 2007, 06:31
Embalmed
Post 21 May 2009, 02:33
For stalin, was it really a dictatorship of the proletariat while he was general secretary?
I don't believe much of the things surrounding him, but it seems like his position as general secretary gave him the power to rubberstamp the rest of the soviet government.

What exactly was the structure of the soviet political system?
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Soviet cogitations: 495
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 03 Mar 2008, 02:36
Komsomol
Post 21 May 2009, 16:03
The dictatorship of the proletariat requires proletarian democracy, so no, it was not. It was a dictatorship in the name of the working class, with many good points, but not a model taht should be slavishly followed.
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Soviet cogitations: 5146
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 08 Nov 2007, 06:31
Embalmed
Post 21 May 2009, 23:19
That's what I was thinking. Still, I don't have an understanding of the structure of the soviet political system so I didn't want to judge.
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Soviet cogitations: 10005
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 14 Jul 2008, 20:01
Ideology: Trotskyism
Philosophized
Post 21 May 2009, 23:37
Stalin never held absolute power.

One of the problems of the political system of the Soviet Union was that there were basically two parallel hierarchies: On one side, you had the Party, and on the other side, you had a [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_democracy"]soviet democracy[/url]. Stalin tried several times to reconcile those parallel systems of government, but he failed since he couldn't convince the rest of the Party to give up its power over the soviets.
"Don't know why i'm still surprised with this shit anyway." - Loz
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Soviet cogitations: 5146
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 08 Nov 2007, 06:31
Embalmed
Post 22 May 2009, 00:04
Get rid of the quotes to make that URL link work.

Did you read about this somewhere? If so, can you tell me where?
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Soviet cogitations: 10005
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 14 Jul 2008, 20:01
Ideology: Trotskyism
Philosophized
Post 22 May 2009, 00:06
http://eserver.org/clogic/2005/furr.html

There you go. As for the link, I trust you to copy and paste.
"Don't know why i'm still surprised with this shit anyway." - Loz
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Soviet cogitations: 5146
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 08 Nov 2007, 06:31
Embalmed
Post 22 May 2009, 00:16
Eh, this is the article fellow comrade PM'd me that I never got to reading thanks to school. Interesting.

On another note, there seems to be a contradiction.

The article you linked claims:

Quote:
22. The democratic aspects of the Constitution were inserted at the express insistence of Joseph Stalin.


It does not cite a source.

The wikipedia article claims (in the 1936 soviet constitution article):

Quote:
Although the soviet propaganda said that the constitution was of Stalin's it was in fact written by a special commission including Nikolai Bukharin, Karl Radek and Yakov Yakovlev[1] all of whom were executed in the Great Purge.


Cites:
^ Roy Medvedev, Let History Judge, 1971
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Soviet cogitations: 9816
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 19 Apr 2008, 03:25
Embalmed
Post 22 May 2009, 00:42
Quote:
Stalin never held absolute power.

Didn't Stalin have emergency powers or something during the war but only during the war that gave him complete control of the Soviet government? I remember reading in a book about him how he was called Supremo during that time.
Once capitalists know we can release the Kraken, they'll back down and obey our demands for sure.
_Comrade Gulper
[+-]
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Soviet cogitations: 9231
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 19 Mar 2005, 20:08
Embalmed
Post 22 May 2009, 00:43
Quote:
I remember reading in a book about him how he was called Supremo during that time.


What kind of book was it?
Image

"Bleh, i don't even know what i'm arguing for. What a stupid rant. Disregard what i wrote." - Loz
"Every time is gyros time" - Stalinista
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Soviet cogitations: 9816
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 19 Apr 2008, 03:25
Embalmed
Post 22 May 2009, 00:44
Stalin Court of the Red Tsar. Huge book, but I managed to get through it.
Once capitalists know we can release the Kraken, they'll back down and obey our demands for sure.
_Comrade Gulper
Soviet cogitations: 10005
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 14 Jul 2008, 20:01
Ideology: Trotskyism
Philosophized
Post 22 May 2009, 00:49
Wikipedia claims that the constitution was "Written" by Bukharin, Radek and Yakovlev. This is an absurd statement. It sounds like those three guys just wrote whatever they wanted, and everything in the 1936 constituion was made up by them. That's very hard to believe. For all we know, the most plausible scenario is that the Politburo debated about the constitutional reform for weeks or months (Stalin's opportunity to insist on the inclusion of democratic aspects), and after they'd reached a decision all Politburo members were content with, Bukharin, Radek and Yakovlev were chosen to compose the final draft.

I guess.

Oh, and what he was called during the War was "Vozhd" (or similar) which means "leader".
"Don't know why i'm still surprised with this shit anyway." - Loz
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 5146
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 08 Nov 2007, 06:31
Embalmed
Post 22 May 2009, 00:51
Sounds about right mabool. "written by a special commission including Nikolai Bukharin, Karl Radek and Yakov Yakovlev" is too ambiguous and seems misleading.

it wouldn't make any sense for 3 people to write up a constitution by themselves while the rest of the system sits on the sidelines.
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Soviet cogitations: 10005
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 14 Jul 2008, 20:01
Ideology: Trotskyism
Philosophized
Post 22 May 2009, 00:57
Exactly. Also, "commissions" were groups of people who were chosen by the Executive Committee (renamed "Supreme Soviet", by the 1936 Constituion, I believe) to do the work the real bosses were too lazy for.
"Don't know why i'm still surprised with this shit anyway." - Loz
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 5146
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 08 Nov 2007, 06:31
Embalmed
Post 22 May 2009, 01:00
Hehe, so we just found bourgeois 'facts', eh?
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Soviet cogitations: 10005
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 14 Jul 2008, 20:01
Ideology: Trotskyism
Philosophized
Post 22 May 2009, 01:10
Exactly. But don't do it at home (or in history class).
"Don't know why i'm still surprised with this shit anyway." - Loz
Soviet cogitations: 113
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 15 Jul 2009, 21:32
Ideology: Democratic Socialism
Pioneer
Post 16 Jul 2009, 00:05
1-De-stalinisation
2-1991 Failed coup attempt
3-Sino-Soviet Split
4-The Cold War(soviets never declaring full scale war against the west.)
5-Corruption inside the CPSU.
Soviet cogitations: 686
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 03 Jul 2009, 15:17
Unperson
Post 16 Jul 2009, 00:24
1. 1991 Failed Coup Attempt
2. Gorbachev
3. Sino-Soviet Split
4. Corruption in the CPSU
5. Pact with Hitler
"Without revolutionary theory there cannot be a revolutionary movement." - Vladimir Lenin, What Is To Be Done?
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