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Pol Pot.

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User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 805
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 28 Jan 2008, 19:10
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Komsomol
Post 30 Apr 2009, 21:08
Take a look at this Soviet text Kampuchea: From Tragedy To Rebirth

http://leninist.biz/en/1979/KTR183/
Kamran Heiss
Soviet cogitations: 3448
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Jun 2006, 15:59
Ideology: Other Leftist
Party Bureaucrat
Post 01 May 2009, 00:13
Quote:
I think that pol pot gets bad press.


Mass murdering psychopaths generally do.
The moment one accepts the notion of 'totalitarianism', one is firmly locked within the liberal-democratic horizon. - Slavoj Žižek
Soviet cogitations: 495
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 03 Mar 2008, 02:36
Komsomol
Post 01 May 2009, 01:31
Quote:
Many of the dead from his regime was because he was simultaneously against America and vietname so he no have any one to help create a communist paradise


Doubtless. But many more were also macheted to death by party members.

I suggest you keep up with the trial of 'Comrade Duch' who was a particularly efficient torturer and executioner, who has recently turned to Christianity and is shedding a lot of light in his role.

Please, do not try and give Pol Pot any veneer of credibility.
Soviet cogitations: 7674
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 11 Nov 2004, 02:08
Embalmed
Post 01 May 2009, 13:01
Quote:
The do nothing hypocrite intellectuals who preach to the working people but do not work themselves were cleverly removed by pol pot.

hahaha I'm going to have FUN with you.
protip, intellectuals advance society, if not for them we would still trying to come up with a vaccine for Polio. Theres good and bad, no different than any branch of society, working, farming, thinking, etc.
Soviet cogitations: 1384
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 28 Feb 2009, 03:41
Party Member
Post 24 May 2009, 08:40
they were not do nothing hypocrite intellectuals, they were intellectuals with glasses. some of them didnt want to remove their glasses and were shot. that kind of stuff. unproper family relationship such as talking was punished by prison too. communism is often totalitarian (at least some leninism has alot of totalitarian ideas), totalitarianism easily turn into absurdity.

if pol pot is to be defended he should be compared to any incompetent rulers and king.
Soviet cogitations: 1583
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 27 Jul 2004, 07:46
Unperson
Post 08 Jul 2009, 01:26
Quote:
I think that pol pot gets bad press. Many of the dead from his regime was because he was simultaneously against America and vietname so he no have any one to help create a communist paradise. The do nothing hypocrite intellectuals who preach to the working people but do not work themselves were cleverly removed by pol pot. he had bad methods and he went crazy like he didnt even like his birthday cake but i think that in the end was he good communist? no. did he try better than pigs like Reagan to create better world? yes he just fail because of conditions in the world and because he grew paranoid from people trying to stop him.


False. China sent heavy amounts of aid, including foodstuffs and weapons. He failed because he completely eschewed the working class and industrialization in favor of a medieval ideology.
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 805
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 28 Jan 2008, 19:10
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Komsomol
Post 08 Jul 2009, 01:37
The Khmer Rouge officially abandoned Marxism in 1981 and openly proclaimed pure nationalism and began referring to "the communists" as the enemy. The Constitution makes even less reference to Marxism than North Korea's and calls for a "non-aligned" state.
Kamran Heiss
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 204
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 25 Sep 2009, 21:46
Pioneer
Post 29 Sep 2009, 23:22
Pol Pot was so insane I dont even think the Nazis would had supported him.

Vietnam invaded his country.

So, no. He has never done anything good. He killed anyone with glasses. He killed anyone who could think.

Lets hope that never happens again!
"A lie told often enough becomes the truth."
-Vladamir Lenin
[+-]
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 4032
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 27 Oct 2006, 23:10
Politburo
Post 30 Sep 2009, 00:46
I heard that he thought he was building communism directly and immediately by killing intellectuals and moving people to the countryside so they could be more easily molded. You have to admit, its an interesting concept.
Soviet cogitations: 3448
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Jun 2006, 15:59
Ideology: Other Leftist
Party Bureaucrat
Post 30 Sep 2009, 04:32
It's a stupid concept.
The moment one accepts the notion of 'totalitarianism', one is firmly locked within the liberal-democratic horizon. - Slavoj Žižek
[+-]
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 1278
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 28 Feb 2009, 02:54
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Party Member
Post 30 Sep 2009, 20:19
Whitten wrote:
It's a stupid concept.


pretty much. Killing people for the sake of killing people is psychopathic. He reminds me of Kim Jong Il in the way he was a complete moron.
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Soviet cogitations: 4953
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 13 Feb 2008, 15:25
Ideology: Other Leftist
Politburo
Post 01 Oct 2009, 03:54
That's a very poor comparison. Intellectuals are encouraged in North Korea.
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 299
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 06 Jul 2009, 10:14
Komsomol
Post 01 Oct 2009, 08:03
Fellow Comrade wrote:
That's a very poor comparison. Intellectuals are encouraged in North Korea.


Not so sure about that. Maybe it's because I'm looking through a western lens but it seems to me North Korea applies brainwashing techniques. But to be honest, I am not very knowledgeable on the North Korean government.
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Soviet cogitations: 4953
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 13 Feb 2008, 15:25
Ideology: Other Leftist
Politburo
Post 01 Oct 2009, 08:56
Without intellectuals and scientists, the North would be completely agrarian. Not even the capital and other major cities would be developed. There wouldn't be a nuclear programme or anything of the like. The spread of computers, an intranet and internet access would not be encouraged. There are several threads in the DPRK section which discuss this. The thing which holds back scientific and intellectual development in the DPRK isn't an anti-intellectual government, but primarily the blockade imposed by the West and UN.

It might be difficult to accept, but most of the North's present problems really are due to the blockades imposed on it. Agriculture is so huge becuase the North can't produce enough fertliser on its own to support the entire industry. Like most parts of Australia, the soil quality is so poor that without it, crop yields are severely affected. Oil shortages mean that modern agricultural machinery have been stored until such time that this changes. This has massive effects on yields and the efficiency of harvesting.

Without powerful nations with Planned economies to interact with it, the North has to deal with the Capitalist world, but has been barred from doing so on its terms. The government has to make a decision; keep going the way it is and hope more nations become friendly to it, or embrace Chinese style market reforms as a means of further industrialising and developing infrastructure. The second option would only widen the development gap between city and country, but it may be the best way to go in the short term. It would also sacrifice some of the national self determination Juche encourages.

I don't think many people on this forum understand Juche very well. It was implemented partly as response to the Sino/Soviet Split. The PRC and USSR had turned on one another, and North Korea was caught in the middle. It wanted to avoiding weighing in on either side and maintain decent relations with both. Taking an independent course was very pragmatic under those circumstances. Also, Koreans have historically been very independent. Even in South Korea, a significant portion of the population (including soldiers in the military) want to see a distancing of relations with the U.S. who are seen as imperialistic. These days, the balancing act between China and the Soviet Union isn't necessary anymore, which supports the view that taking the Chinese route might be the most beneficial for now.

While there are legitimate criticisms of the DPRK (no nation is perfect), I believe it is still primarily Socialist in character and that regarding it as if it were an enemy is a fundamentally flawed position.
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 299
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 06 Jul 2009, 10:14
Komsomol
Post 01 Oct 2009, 19:34
Fellow Comrade,

If you consider the rule of Kim to be an example of the dictatorship of the proletariat, then color me a capitalist wanker. I said this in another thread. We cannot and will not become apologists for pseudo-communist regimes.
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Soviet cogitations: 5151
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 08 Nov 2007, 06:31
Embalmed
Post 02 Oct 2009, 00:31
The North's ability to accomplish so much and still refuse to sell out its people is remarkable. But I would think twice before I called it a workers' state
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Soviet cogitations: 4953
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 13 Feb 2008, 15:25
Ideology: Other Leftist
Politburo
Post 02 Oct 2009, 03:36
Quote:
Fellow Comrade,

If you consider the rule of Kim to be an example of the dictatorship of the proletariat, then color me a capitalist wanker. I said this in another thread. We cannot and will not become apologists for pseudo-communist regimes.


I consider Juche to be an implementation of Marxism interpreted through the eyes of Korean culture and sensibilities. The only thing I don't like about it is the emphasis on the "Dear Leader" concept. That could be changed however. Regardless of this, the North is still economically Socialist.

Why do you think North Korea is a "pseudo-communist regime"? I can't reply until you give a definition of this term and how it applies to the north.
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 299
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 06 Jul 2009, 10:14
Komsomol
Post 03 Oct 2009, 23:00
North Korea is an inherently oppressive system of extensive government spying, extrajudicial punishment, and political "purging", or elimination of political opponents either by direct killing or through exile, and it involves a state making extensive use of propaganda to establish a personality cult around an absolute dictator to maintain control over the nation's people and to maintain political control. NK is not using democratic centralism. It is a dictatorship of one man, Kim, not the proletariat. Saying Juche is a form of North Korean Marxism is an excuse for manipulating Marxism and twisting it. North Korea is essential exercising stalinism. I know many comrades here are proponents of stalinism, but I don't care. No where in Marxist text can you find justification for a personality cult. Hence it is a pseudo communist regime. Communist in ideology and name, but not in practice.
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Soviet cogitations: 495
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 03 Mar 2008, 02:36
Komsomol
Post 04 Oct 2009, 00:15
Red Bull, I totally agree with you that NK is a retarded place, but I've noticed in your posting before that you seem very individualist and aloof in your ideology.

You have said several times things along the lines of "They are not my comrade if x" and you make a lot of categorical statements that totally write off certain movements. I remember this especially when you were writing about FARC, and sarcastically implied that their leadership were uneducated gangsters, clearly highlighting your own lack of knowledge about the intellectual roots and the documents produced by those in FARC (this is a seperate point as to whether FARC is justified in it's actions).

Without wanting to sound supercilious myself, it may serve you better, comrade, to be a little more collegiate in your approach.
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 299
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 06 Jul 2009, 10:14
Komsomol
Post 04 Oct 2009, 00:43
Sholokhov, I'm entitled to my opinion. And it is my opinion that NK and FARC are poor examples of Marxism. So I am consistent in my beliefs. Ive only spoken on two movements, so be careful when painting me with a broad brush. Don't even get me started on the FARC. Sometimes I think some members here would defend Osama bin Laden if he declared himself a Marxist.
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