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Rudi Dutschke: revolutionary in the 60'ies

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Soviet cogitations: 2932
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 16 Aug 2006, 17:30
Party Bureaucrat
Post 02 Nov 2006, 01:45
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Socialism =/= Marxism

Socialism is a marxist stage. Socialism is also a leninist term.

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In fact he considered himself a christian democratic socialist in his youth and the end of his life.

That could be, but not during his activist period.

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No but every single german marxist party and the SED do.

SED was the party of the DDR, hardly not an actor in the BRD.
I doubt it that all +- 15 marxist parties in the BRD were against reunification. Especially when the DKP meant nothing on the field and in electoral results. SDS carried the 60'ies, no doubt about that.
It is not because the SDS didn't follow the directions of the SED, they were not marxists. I would like to see in the works of Lenin or Marx where I could find such nonsense.
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Ideology transforms human beings into subjects, leading them to see themselves as self-determining agents when they are in fact shaped by ideological processes. L. Althusser
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Soviet cogitations: 368
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Aug 2006, 13:32
Komsomol
Post 03 Nov 2006, 17:50
The SDS wasn't a marxist organisation.
If the Tiger does not stop fighting the Elephant, the Elephant will die of exhaustion.
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Soviet cogitations: 2932
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 16 Aug 2006, 17:30
Party Bureaucrat
Post 03 Nov 2006, 18:25
What the hell, their members were excluded from the SPD because of their marxist views.
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Ideology transforms human beings into subjects, leading them to see themselves as self-determining agents when they are in fact shaped by ideological processes. L. Althusser
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Soviet cogitations: 368
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Aug 2006, 13:32
Komsomol
Post 03 Nov 2006, 19:04
No, members of the SDS were excluded from the SDS itself because of their marxist views due to pressure from Helmut Schmidt and Kurt Schumacher.

Later on Ulrike Meinhof and Oswald Hüller formed a faction of marxist pro-DDR SDS members which was once again excluded from the SDS.
If the Tiger does not stop fighting the Elephant, the Elephant will die of exhaustion.
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Soviet cogitations: 2932
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 16 Aug 2006, 17:30
Party Bureaucrat
Post 03 Nov 2006, 19:44
Quote:
No, members of the SDS were excluded from the SDS itself because of their marxist views due to pressure from Helmut Schmidt and Kurt Schumacher.

No, that was the battle between the student movement and the members of the DKP. Schmidt was an opponent of both, SDS was writen off as a friendly organisation because of the radicalisation and adoption of marxist views (fe. Marcuse).

The SDS had started in 1946 as a social democratic student organization, but refused to follow the SPD on its revisionist road to 'Bad Godesberg'. While the SPD began to promote a more loyal student organization - the Sozialdemokratische Hochschulbund (SHB) - the SDS rediscovered Marx. A majority interpreted Marx in the light of the Frankfurter Schule, but a minority turned to orthodox Marxism.
M. Fennema - The communist parties in Western Europe

The minority formed the Spartakus group, which was monopolised by the DKP. It had no success, so it sought alliances with other minorities. Meanwhile the SDS was certainly the main force of the marxist student movement.
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Ideology transforms human beings into subjects, leading them to see themselves as self-determining agents when they are in fact shaped by ideological processes. L. Althusser
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Soviet cogitations: 368
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Aug 2006, 13:32
Komsomol
Post 03 Nov 2006, 21:23
The only things they rediscovered were border line anarchistic thoughts and opposition to every established socialist government of that time.

You don't get far by denying every single version of marxism that existed at that time.
If the Tiger does not stop fighting the Elephant, the Elephant will die of exhaustion.
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Soviet cogitations: 2932
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 16 Aug 2006, 17:30
Party Bureaucrat
Post 03 Nov 2006, 22:20
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The only things they rediscovered were border line anarchistic thoughts and opposition to every established socialist government of that time.

Well, I believe they received some lessons from the situation in the DDR. Freedom is also a necessary item in a marxist revolution.

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You don't get far by denying every single version of marxism that existed at that time.

And yet their main marxist thinker and supporter was Marcuse. How odd ...
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Ideology transforms human beings into subjects, leading them to see themselves as self-determining agents when they are in fact shaped by ideological processes. L. Althusser
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Soviet cogitations: 368
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Aug 2006, 13:32
Komsomol
Post 04 Nov 2006, 07:55
When exactly did Marcuse lead a revolutionary movement and/or led a socialist country?
If the Tiger does not stop fighting the Elephant, the Elephant will die of exhaustion.
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Soviet cogitations: 2932
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 16 Aug 2006, 17:30
Party Bureaucrat
Post 04 Nov 2006, 13:26
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When exactly did Marcuse lead a revolutionary movement and/or led a socialist country?
He was not the leader of the student movement, he was one of the ideologists.
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Ideology transforms human beings into subjects, leading them to see themselves as self-determining agents when they are in fact shaped by ideological processes. L. Althusser
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Soviet cogitations: 368
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Aug 2006, 13:32
Komsomol
Post 04 Nov 2006, 14:42
Quote:
He was not the leader of the student movement, he was one of the ideologists.


Which equals do nothing but moan all day how bad capitalism and soviet/chinese socialism are.
If the Tiger does not stop fighting the Elephant, the Elephant will die of exhaustion.
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Soviet cogitations: 2932
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 16 Aug 2006, 17:30
Party Bureaucrat
Post 04 Nov 2006, 14:57
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Which equals do nothing but moan all day how bad capitalism and soviet/chinese socialism are.

I still use K. Marx as a source, they did it also with Marcuse. Or do I only need to do the practise without the guidance?
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Ideology transforms human beings into subjects, leading them to see themselves as self-determining agents when they are in fact shaped by ideological processes. L. Althusser
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Soviet cogitations: 368
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Aug 2006, 13:32
Komsomol
Post 04 Nov 2006, 15:26
Marxism-leninism is guidance enough for every communist, one doesn't need revisionism for revolutionary practise.
If the Tiger does not stop fighting the Elephant, the Elephant will die of exhaustion.
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 2932
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 16 Aug 2006, 17:30
Party Bureaucrat
Post 04 Nov 2006, 16:29
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Marxism-leninism is guidance enough for every communist, one doesn't need revisionism for revolutionary practise.
I'm not a marxist-leninist, only a marxist with attention for Lenin. I don't think you can call that revisionism.
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Ideology transforms human beings into subjects, leading them to see themselves as self-determining agents when they are in fact shaped by ideological processes. L. Althusser
Soviet cogitations: 136
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Oct 2006, 03:07
Pioneer
Post 05 Nov 2006, 02:08
Quote:
'm not a marxist-leninist, only a marxist with attention for Lenin. I don't think you can call that revisionism.


There's a name for that: Trotskyism.
"Check ya self before ya wreck ya self, aiii"
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Soviet cogitations: 2932
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 16 Aug 2006, 17:30
Party Bureaucrat
Post 05 Nov 2006, 02:38
Not really, I'm not a trot. I find the best period in the USSR, besides when Lenin was alive, the era under Khrushchev.
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Ideology transforms human beings into subjects, leading them to see themselves as self-determining agents when they are in fact shaped by ideological processes. L. Althusser
Soviet cogitations: 136
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 26 Oct 2006, 03:07
Pioneer
Post 05 Nov 2006, 06:35
Quote:
Not really, I'n not a trot.


I didn't claim nor was I attempting to insinuate that you were one. I don't think you're a Trot. You sided with Bukharin in one of the previous polls. You sided with a right opportunist. However, many Trotskyists would define themselves as "only a marxist with attention for Lenin". I guess the same applies for Bukharinists.
"Check ya self before ya wreck ya self, aiii"
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