U.S.S.R. and communism historical discussion.
[ Active ]
[ Login ]
Log-in to remove these advertisements.

Do you belive that there was holodomor



Total votes : 51
Soviet cogitations: 54
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 19 May 2014, 02:13
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Post 20 May 2014, 06:59
It's already been debunked time and time again but I'l say it one more time anyway.
Stalin and the Soviet Union did not murder millions in an intentional genocide! The vast majority of countries in the world do not accept that this was an intentional genocide of people. The only countries that do is the United States and 15 of it's puppets. I'm sad to say my home country of Canada is one of them. Stalin was a flawed leader but we need to get passed this idea he is a genocidal murder who killed millions of people like Hitler. Executions under Stalin's regime were in the hundreds of thousands (And it's quite possibly in the tens of thousands). This doesn't even put him in the category of Reagan, George W Bush, Trueman, or Obama in terms of people killed by his policy. Most of the people executed under Stalin were guilty of crimes they commited. Most people killed by the US through wars of imperialism were killed because they got in the way of imperialism.

The United States by comparison has killed
2.5 million in the Korean War
3.1 million in the Vietnam War
2 million in the Afghanistan War (1978-Present)
1 million in the Iraq War (2003-2011)
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 37
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 16 Jul 2014, 11:33
Post 16 Jul 2014, 13:55
I believe that while there certainly was a famine, it was by no means planned or in any way deliberate.

PS Well said comrade RedGeek.
Soviet cogitations: 54
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 19 May 2014, 02:13
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Post 13 Aug 2014, 06:31
Stalin ended the famines. The famine of 1931-1932 was the last such Famine to occure in the Soviet Union. Famines had litterally, always existed in Tsarist Russia. There were massive famines that killed millions ever few years because Russia was backward, overtly feudal (until 1860s) then semi-feudal (untill the 1920s), undeveloped, agrarian, peasant basket-case. The New Economic Policy (1922-1928) and Industrialization & Collectivization under the Five Year Plans (1930s-onwards) ended the famines. The only famine after that was in 1947 and that was because of WW2 (which the USSR quickly recovered from to become a superpower).

"Forced" Collectivization wasn't sometype of Genocide or Democide. It was done in response to the famine to increase yield. And it worked as mentioned the famines stoped. In addition the Soviet government drastically reduced the amount of grain being exported from the area to a tiny fraction what it was previously (to allow those starving to eat more of what they produced) and when they realized how desperate it was, they stoped all exports and sent Food Aid.

It is interesting that I hear this argument about Famines come up regarding Maoist China. Once again, China's famines ended with rise of Socialism. China had suffered famines litterally forever untill suddenly they stoped under Mao Zedong's rule. Just when he collectivized agriculture, interesting.

What about India, they continue to suffer massive famines today. Indeed it is more appropriat to say that India's adoption of Capitalism has resulted in millions dying in famines (as these famines stop whenever Socialist development is instituted). You also never hear about the REAL intentional famines caused by the British in India during Colonialism and Imperialist domination. How many tens or hundreds of millions of people were murdered by the British Empire over the hundreds of years of Colonialism in outright Genocide. But we never get tought about British and American Genocides in the 18th, 19th, 20th and 21st Century.

Do the history books in school tell the Youth that it was the Communists, Socialists and Trade Unionists that opposed Fascism/Nazism and warned of impending Genocide, War and Imperialism. The Communists and Red Army fought Fascism in Spain when nobody else would lift a finger. The USSR sent the Nazis running all the way back to Berlin before Hitler committed suicide in fear. Stalin proposed an Anti-Nazi alliance in 1938 to the allied nations who refused. If the German Communists in 1919 had come to power Nazi Germany and Fascism would never have existed (and world war 2 wouldn't have happened). To compare Stalin or Mao, some of the greatest liberators of poor and opressed people to Hitler is to lie. It is as bad as Holocaust denial itself.
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 1441
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 29 Sep 2011, 13:51
Ideology: Democratic Socialism
Party Member
Post 13 Aug 2014, 12:50
I was wondering when you would write another great post. Post of the day goes to RedGeek! Bravo!

The great art of life is sensation, to feel that you exist, even in pain.
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 33
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 17 Nov 2015, 22:40
Ideology: Maoist
Post 27 Nov 2015, 12:08
Most of the deaths during the time of "the holodomor" where not even in Ukraine. Starvation happened but that was the fault of the Kulaks. Stalin didn't "intentionally starve millions of Ukrainians" that is absolute bullshit
Alternative Display:
Mobile view
More Forums: The History Forum. The UK Politics Forum.
© 2000- Privacy.