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is vietnam really comie??

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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 29 May 2009, 06:47
Komsomol
Post 29 May 2009, 07:05
In our Vietnam, now we are developing something called "Neo-communism". Our ideas and political system are communism, but our ecocnomy is capitalism. Why? Because our country is poor, and we have to go back to the old capitalism economy to grow up. If we didn't go back to this economy in 1986, now I'm sure that my country is one of the poorest and most starvation in Earth, even don't have computers and TVs.
P/s: sorry for my bad english
"Whatever may divide us, Europe is a common home, a common fate that has linked us for years, and it continues to link us today."
Leonid Brezhnev
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Soviet cogitations: 418
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 29 May 2009, 06:47
Komsomol
Post 30 May 2009, 16:08
Maybe you guys misunderstand my country....We are developing something called Neo-Communism, by using Communism politics but Capitalist economy. If we hadn't change to the capitalist economic in 1986, we wouldn't have computers, TVs or modern things. I think that's good for our country.Don't compare it with the Perestroika.
And my country DIDN'T INVADE Cambodia, they invade us first. (If you don't believe it, ask Hun Sen, Prime Minister of Cambodia now).
"Whatever may divide us, Europe is a common home, a common fate that has linked us for years, and it continues to link us today."
Leonid Brezhnev
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Soviet cogitations: 6887
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 30 Nov 2007, 08:37
Unperson
Post 04 Jun 2009, 06:45
I believe we're well clear on the Khmer Rouge issue.

The question here is whether the leadership of Vietnam will be willing to facilitate the transition from current capitalist economics to communist ones. If they become personally involved in the money making structures, then there is a high possibility for conflict of interest and just plain corruption.
banistansig1
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Soviet cogitations: 136
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 17 Sep 2008, 17:13
Pioneer
Post 04 Jun 2009, 15:11
Hi! Interesting to hear from the vietnamese comrades. Please elaborate more about the political, ideological, economical situation of the SR of Vietnam.
"For us there is no valid definition of socialism other than the abolition of the exploitation of one human being by another."
Soviet cogitations: 6887
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 30 Nov 2007, 08:37
Unperson
Post 04 Jun 2009, 22:20
I'm also curious what his avatar symbolizes. It has the Russian state flag and coat of arms, with a red Soviet star.
banistansig1
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 19 Mar 2005, 20:08
Embalmed
Post 04 Jun 2009, 22:27
I think the problem Vietnam faces that the USSR didn't face is that today capitalism is a global system and it's impossible to stay fairly isolated in terms of capital and still be able to develop a reasonable standard of living. And while having to trade with other countries wore away the USSR's independence (in antithesis to interdependence with capitalist nations here), it was nothing in comparison with Vietnam allowing foreign access to its economy without which it would not reach similar levels of efficiency in any reasonable lengths of time.
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 07 Jul 2006, 04:49
Ideology: Juche
Old Bolshevik
Post 07 Jun 2009, 01:38
Quote:
I'm also curious what his avatar symbolizes. It has the Russian state flag and coat of arms, with a red Soviet star.


Either the Soviet Federation or the Union of Russian Federal Republics. ~_^ Either that or he might think that the Double Eagle is a cool symbol and used it along with the Red Star.
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Soviet cogitations: 4953
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 13 Feb 2008, 15:25
Ideology: Other Leftist
Politburo
Post 07 Jun 2009, 02:28
I think the reasons it Vietnam has turned to a market style economy are similar to China's. I don't think they have completely abandoned Socialism also. I remember having a fairly brief pm conversation with a Vietnamese comrade last year, and he seemed to have come to a similar conclusion.
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 10 Sep 2006, 22:05
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Philosophized
Post 08 Jun 2009, 11:01
I have much more faith in Vietnamese socialism than Chinese. As far as I can tell the Vietnamese haven't repelled as much of the worker's protections that china has and also hasn't legitimized private property. Plus the lack of SEZs like China's where exploitation is on par with the worst of capitalist nations.
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 17 Sep 2008, 17:13
Pioneer
Post 08 Jun 2009, 22:19
I agree in general with the last statement.

But we need more scientific, material facts etc to analyze more thoroughly the building of socialism in all countriesm but especially China, Laos, Vietnam; also DPRK and of course the others.

Especially in the economical and ideological field , giving prerequisite to the ecomonical changes being made and the ideological analyzes the decision are made on the basis of, adhering to marxist-leninist analyze and politics.
"For us there is no valid definition of socialism other than the abolition of the exploitation of one human being by another."
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Soviet cogitations: 208
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 30 May 2009, 19:37
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Pioneer
Post 10 Jun 2009, 15:33
The Communist Party of Vietnam is too slow. They must speed up the privatization.
Don't misundertood me. Because privatization will make more people become proletariats. And a lot of proletariats mean socialism revolution.

Karl Marx said that:
"Is that to say we are against Free Trade? No, we are for Free Trade, because by Free Trade all economical laws, with their most astounding contradictions, will act upon a larger scale, upon the territory of the whole earth; and because from the uniting of all these contradictions in a single group, where they will stand face to face, will result the struggle which will itself eventuate in the emancipation of the proletariat." Writing in the Chartist newspaper, 1847. (Marx Engels Collected Works Vol 6, pg 290).

Now in Vietnam, many rice field are becoming golf course and many peasants lost land. Yes, they have received money but they don't know what to do with it. When they use up all money they will become proletariats. This happened in England before and now in Vietnam. But in Vietnam, it is not "sheep eat man" but "golf eat man"
"Stalin brought us up — on loyalty to the people, He inspired us to labor and to heroism!" Soviet Anthem 1944.
Let's work hard and do valorous deed!
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Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 29 May 2009, 06:47
Komsomol
Post 13 Jun 2009, 03:57
@Engelsist: Uh-ohh...Maybe you don't know...but my country is going to industrialize the economy...Well, we don't want to have a socialist revolution, because we're socialist already. And we are different from England, because our country hadn't passed the capitalist era in the past...We "jump" from Monarchism straight to Communism....And how do you know that our rice field became golf course? (I'm surprise about that if you're not Vietnamese) ...Not only golf course, but many fields are being changed to skyscraper...Soon our country won't be the 2nd rice exporter anymore..
"Whatever may divide us, Europe is a common home, a common fate that has linked us for years, and it continues to link us today."
Leonid Brezhnev
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Soviet cogitations: 208
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 30 May 2009, 19:37
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Pioneer
Post 13 Jun 2009, 04:35
Quote:
Well, we don't want to have a socialist revolution, because we're socialist already.


Vietnam is half socialist because they reject The dictatorship of the proletariat. In 1992 Constitution, The dictatorship of the proletariat was removed and instead of it, that is State of people, by people and for people.

We need another Revolution and reinstall The dictatorship of the proletariat.
"Stalin brought us up — on loyalty to the people, He inspired us to labor and to heroism!" Soviet Anthem 1944.
Let's work hard and do valorous deed!
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Soviet cogitations: 418
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 29 May 2009, 06:47
Komsomol
Post 13 Jun 2009, 08:50
Oh...I'm don't want to argue with you but...I think that after the Soviet Union collapsed, if we continue using the dictatorship of the proletariat, it may affect our economy and our industrialize, modernize progress. The State of people, by people and for people is not very bad....
In my idea, I think that we should "go back" for about 10 or 20 years, then we'll remain fully socialist again.
.
P/s: @misuzu: I am Vietnamese but I like Russia, really. Although nominally they aren't communist anymore, but in the future they will be back....because there are still many communist era memorials and celebrities in Russia now.
Sorry for my bad English.
"Whatever may divide us, Europe is a common home, a common fate that has linked us for years, and it continues to link us today."
Leonid Brezhnev
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Soviet cogitations: 4953
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 13 Feb 2008, 15:25
Ideology: Other Leftist
Politburo
Post 13 Jun 2009, 10:28
Quote:
Vietnam is half socialist because they reject The dictatorship of the proletariat. In 1992 Constitution, The dictatorship of the proletariat was removed and instead of it, that is State of people, by people and for people.


That's pretty much just nomenclature. It's the substance that's important. Lenin chose to use the term "Dictatorship of the proletariat", but that doesn't mean you can't use other wording to get the same or similar message across.
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Soviet cogitations: 208
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 30 May 2009, 19:37
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Pioneer
Post 13 Jun 2009, 12:49
Quote:
That's pretty much just nomenclature. It's the substance that's important. Lenin chose to use the term "Dictatorship of the proletariat", but that doesn't mean you can't use other wording to get the same or similar message across.


I agree with you.

But if there is bourgeoisie in "people", we can't consider "State of people, by people and for people" is "Dictatorship of the proletariat".

If Vietnam really is socialist, they must exclude bourgeoisie from people.
"Stalin brought us up — on loyalty to the people, He inspired us to labor and to heroism!" Soviet Anthem 1944.
Let's work hard and do valorous deed!
User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 4953
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 13 Feb 2008, 15:25
Ideology: Other Leftist
Politburo
Post 13 Jun 2009, 12:53
I see what you're saying, but I still think Vietnam is ultimately on the right track.
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Soviet cogitations: 208
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 30 May 2009, 19:37
Ideology: Marxism-Leninism
Pioneer
Post 13 Jun 2009, 13:04
Yes, i think so. You can't avoid capitalism in order to become socialist unless you get help from another socialist country.
But no matter what, Vietnam will become socialist. No one can't avoid socialism too, right?
"Stalin brought us up — on loyalty to the people, He inspired us to labor and to heroism!" Soviet Anthem 1944.
Let's work hard and do valorous deed!
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User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 418
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 29 May 2009, 06:47
Komsomol
Post 13 Jun 2009, 13:10
Quote:
If Vietnam really is socialist, they must exclude bourgeoisie from people.

Well, if we exclude them, our economy will be totally collapse
...Because there are many private companies in VN now
...they help with the grow up of the economy, make jobs for people...And they aren't very bad...
May be you are an original-Marxist...but may you have a wider look please...
"Whatever may divide us, Europe is a common home, a common fate that has linked us for years, and it continues to link us today."
Leonid Brezhnev
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User avatar
Soviet cogitations: 418
Defected to the U.S.S.R.: 29 May 2009, 06:47
Komsomol
Post 26 Jun 2009, 06:52
Hey why no one care about VN???
"Whatever may divide us, Europe is a common home, a common fate that has linked us for years, and it continues to link us today."
Leonid Brezhnev
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