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Was the loss at Kiev neccesary to save Moscow?

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Post 03 Apr 2007, 00:50
JFC Fuller the inventor of blitzkrieg considers the Nazi victory at Kiev the most brillant victory in history. He compares it to Hannibal's victory at Cannae. It was the largest
encirclement in history and 600,000 Soviet troops were lost.

My question is were they lost in vain? The battle occurred in
fall of 1941 when the Nazis were very near Moscow already and had there not been the Soviet "bait" at Kiev Hitler probaly wouldnt have considered it such a neccesary target and pushed straight for Moscow. Kiev was the worst Soviet loss of the war but perhaps not worthless?

Opinions?
Post 03 Apr 2007, 01:34
My opinion is that it was virtually impossible to hold on to Kiev in the fall of 1941.
Post 03 Apr 2007, 02:03
No question that Kiev would have fallen no matter what. but the question is was it a waist to send 600,000 troops to defend it?

They were encircled fairly rapidly but they might have saved Moscow.
Post 03 Apr 2007, 02:07
Obviously, since the outcome was the way it was, it's impossible to - as a marxist - claim that the defensive stance on Kiev was in vain.

Had those soldiers not been stationed there, the outcome of this war might have been different.
There is no such thing as a "pointless action" in reality
Post 03 Apr 2007, 13:40
For the USSR, defeding Kiev was not a waste of time, because as you have inferred, it delayed the Nazi advance on Moscow and bought time for easetern troops to come to Moscow's defense. It delayed the Germans for 4 weeks

For the Germans, Kiev was only useful if they intended to advance in the south, which they did not plan to do in 1941.
Post 18 Apr 2007, 06:08
Quote:
The battle occurred in fall of 1941 when the Nazis were very near Moscow already and had there not been the Soviet "bait" at Kiev Hitler probaly wouldnt have considered it such a neccesary target and pushed straight for Moscow. Kiev was the worst Soviet loss of the war but perhaps not worthless?

If Hitler "pushed at Moscow", he would've overextended his flanks and have a 600000-strong South-West Front striking at the weakest logistics point. It would've been a ruin quite like Stalingrad, so in no way Hitler could've avoided destroying the South-Western Front prior to attacking the center Russia.
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