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What if: Yugoslavia Axis country

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Post 08 Feb 2005, 12:53
Lets assume that there was no coup d'état i and the goverment that supported Axis stayed in power.

What do you think?
Last edited by Carius on 28 Mar 2006, 13:42, edited 1 time in total.
Post 08 Feb 2005, 16:08
If the Belgrad coup would not have happened, i think that revolts would have happend in other places in yugoslavia, and i dont think many officers would like to be puppets.
Post 08 Feb 2005, 17:43
Yugoslavia wouldnt have been a puppet of Germany. Yugoslavia would have been one Axis.
Last edited by Carius on 28 Mar 2006, 13:45, edited 1 time in total.
Post 08 Feb 2005, 18:59
Quote:
Yugoslavia wouldnt have been a puppet of Germany. Yugoslavia would have been one Axis.


I regard all the axis contrys as puppets of the Germans (exept Japan ofcorse)
Post 08 Feb 2005, 19:16
I'm sure that Hitler had to hold off operation Barbarossa a few weeks because Italians were doing so poorly against the Greeks....

Those Italians had a sad army in that war...
Post 08 Feb 2005, 19:56
He would have likely sended small force to help Italians.
Last edited by Carius on 28 Mar 2006, 13:47, edited 1 time in total.
Post 08 Feb 2005, 20:33
thanks for cleaing that up.....

grampa must be lying....poor senile old grampa....
Post 08 Feb 2005, 22:59
Attacking Balkans, or Greece was never Hitlers plan.

Hitler wanted to dominate the Balkans by peaceful means, by getting Yugoslavia to join the Axis and Greece to remain neutral. He never wanted to attack Yugoslavia or Greece. Italy's ill-fated offensive against Greece wrecked Hitler's diplomatic plans.
Post 09 Feb 2005, 16:18
Quote:
Those Italians had a sad army in that war...


Winston Churchill said something to a German dipolmat like

German Diplomat- "If their is a war, you do realise that Italy will be on our side this time."

Churchill- "It is only fair. We had them last time."

The quote is not exact, but you get the point.
Post 11 Apr 2005, 20:07
Hitler did have plans to invade and dominate the Balkans. This was decided November 1940.
Post 11 Apr 2005, 20:38
No. He didnt.

Hitler wanted to dominate the Balkans by peaceful means, by getting Yugoslavia to join the Axis and Greece to remain neutral. He never wanted to attack Yugoslavia or Greece. Italy's ill-fated offensive against Greece wrecked Hitler's diplomatic plans.

By the way, be thankful that Finns didnt cut Lake Ladoga, Leningrads life blood. Finns could have done that, but they didnt.
Post 12 Apr 2005, 03:38
Beowulf wrote:
No. He didnt.

Hitler wanted to dominate the Balkans by peaceful means, by getting Yugoslavia to join the Axis and Greece to remain neutral. He never wanted to attack Yugoslavia or Greece. Italy's ill-fated offensive against Greece wrecked Hitler's diplomatic plans.

By the way, be thankful that Finns didnt cut Lake Ladoga, Leningrads life blood. Finns could have done that, but they didnt.


Quote:
By the way, be thankful that Finns didnt cut Lake Ladoga, Leningrads life blood. Finns could have done that, but they didnt.


The Russians could have flattened Helsinki but they didn’t.


Quote:
No. He didn’t


My god! You have completely persuaded me to believe your opinion. The invasion of the Balkans was inevitable since the Yugoslavs and Greeks are courageous peoples, which do not surrender without a struggle. Unlike some other nations.

The invasion of the Balkans was decided in 1940 with Directive No. 20, Operation Marita. It was a planned invasion and was not organized with forces intended for the invasion of Russia.

http://www.adolfhitler.ws/lib/proc/direct20.html
Post 12 Apr 2005, 08:28
Quote:
which do not surrender without a struggle.


Like Denmark
Post 12 Apr 2005, 10:52
Quote:
The Russians could have flattened Helsinki but they didn’t.


USSR had spended all 33 divisions they were supposed to use to conquer Finland in 1944.

Quote:
The invasion of the Balkans was inevitable since the Yugoslavs and Greeks are courageous peoples, which do not surrender without a struggle. Unlike some other nations.


Excuse me, but what are you talking about? Yugoslavian goverment was Axis friendly, and Hitler wanted Greece to remain neutral. However, Italy's ill-fated offensive against Greece wrecked Hitler's diplomatic plans. Italians Greece campaing also effected in Yugoslavia, and soon the Axis friendly goverment was taken out of power.

Quote:
The invasion of the Balkans was decided in 1940


At this time, on December, Italians had already attacked Greece. Italians attacked Greece on October 28th 1940, and this is what ruined Hitlers diplomatic plans.

Your story is filled with holes.

As I yust said, Italians attack Greece on October 1940. On December 4th, Mussolini sended Dino Alfieri to Berlin to ask assistance form Germany. Hitler saw no choise but to assist Italians.
Last edited by Carius on 28 Mar 2006, 13:49, edited 1 time in total.
Post 15 Apr 2005, 04:27
Maksym wrote:
Beowulf wrote:
No. He didnt.

Hitler wanted to dominate the Balkans by peaceful means, by getting Yugoslavia to join the Axis and Greece to remain neutral. He never wanted to attack Yugoslavia or Greece. Italy's ill-fated offensive against Greece wrecked Hitler's diplomatic plans.

By the way, be thankful that Finns didnt cut Lake Ladoga, Leningrads life blood. Finns could have done that, but they didnt.


Quote:
By the way, be thankful that Finns didnt cut Lake Ladoga, Leningrads life blood. Finns could have done that, but they didnt.


The Russians could have flattened Helsinki but they didn’t.


Quote:
No. He didn’t


My god! You have completely persuaded me to believe your opinion. The invasion of the Balkans was inevitable since the Yugoslavs and Greeks are courageous peoples, which do not surrender without a struggle. Unlike some other nations.

The invasion of the Balkans was decided in 1940 with Directive No. 20, Operation Marita. It was a planned invasion and was not organized with forces intended for the invasion of Russia.

http://www.adolfhitler.ws/lib/proc/direct20.html


“Story”? Did you actually read the order?

Quote:
Operation Marita
Directive No. 20
Supreme Commander of the armed Forces Most Secret Senior commanders only Führer Headquarters 13th December 1940 12 copies
Undertaking Marita
1.The outcome of the battles in Albania is still uncertain. In the light of the threatening situation in Albania it is doubly important to frustrate English efforts to establish, behind the protection of a Balkan front,an air base which would threaten Italy in the first place and , incidentally, the Rumanian oilfields.
2. My intention is therefore-
a) To establish in the coming months a constantly increasing force in Southern Rumania.
b) On the arrival of favorable weather--probably in March--to move this force across Bulgaria to occupy the north coast of the Aegean and should this be necessary the entire mainland of Greece ('undertaking Marita'). We can rely upon Bulgarian support
3. The build up of the forces in Rumania will be as follows:
a) 16th Panzer Division which arrives in December will join the Military Mission whose duties remain unchanged.
b) Subsequently a force of about seven divisions will be moved to Southern Rumania. Engineer forces in sufficient strength to prepare the Danube crossings can be incorporated in the transports of the 16th Panzer Division(as"instruction forces'). Commander-in-Chief Army will apply for my orders for the employment of these troops on the Danube in due course.
c) Preparations should be made to transport reinforcements until the total limit of twenty four divisions intended for 'Undertaking Marita' has been reached.
d) The Air Force must afford air defense for the concentration and will arrange for the necessary headquarters and supply dumps on Rumanian soil.
4. 'undertaking Marita' itself will be prepared on the following basis:
a) The first objective of the operation is the occupation of the Aegean coast and the Salonika basin. It may become necessary to pursue the attack via Larissa and the Isthmus of Corinth
b) The flank of the attack will be protected against Turkey by the Bulgarian Army; but German units will also be held in readiness to strengthen and support it.
c) It is not yet certain whether Bulgarian formations will play any role in the attack. The attitude of Yugoslavia is also ot yet clearly foreseeable.
d) It will be the task of the Air FOrce to give effective support in all phases to the advance of the Army; to eliminate the enemy Air Force; and as far as possible to seize English bases in the Greek Islands with airborne troops.
e) The question how far 'undertaking Marietta' is to be supported by the Italian forces and how such operations are to be coordinated is reserved for future decision.
5. The political effect of military which is especially felt in the Balkans calls for the most precise regulation of all measures taken by the high command.The Movement of troops through Hungary and their arrival in Rumania will be notified stage by stage by the High Command of the Armed Forces and will in the first instance be explained as reinforcements for the Military Mission in Rumania. Conversationa with Rumanians or Bulgarians which might reveal our intentions as well as notification of the Italians will depend in each case on my approval , as also will dispatch of reconnaissance parties and advanced headquarters.
6. At the conclusion of 'undertaking Marita' the forces engaged will be withdrawn for new employment.
7. I expect Commanders-in-Chief to report to me on their plans. The Army has already done this. A precise time-table for the operation should be submitted to me as well as proposals for the recall of men from the armaments industry where necessary (re-establishment of 'Leave Divisions')
(signed)
Adolf Hitler
Post 15 Apr 2005, 06:22
Yes, I did, and it is you who doesnt seem to undrestand.

Hitler had wanted to dominate Balkans by peaceful means, by getting Yugoslavia to join the Axis and Greece to remain neutral. He never wanted to attack Yugoslavia or Greece. Italy's ill-fated offensive against Greece wrecked Hitler's diplomatic plans.

However, on October 28th 1940, Italians launched their attack agaisnt Greece. They hadnt told about this to Germans.

The Italians were driven back by Greek forces. On December 4th, Mussolini sended Dino Alfieri to Berlin to ask assistance form Germany. Hitler saw no choise but to assist Italians. His political plans had already been ruined.

Now, see the date of Italians attack to Greece. October 28th. See the date when Dino Alfieri arrived to Berlin. Decenber 4th. See the date on order. December 13th.

....
Post 15 Apr 2005, 15:54
This was your incorrect response:roll:
Post 15 Apr 2005, 16:06
Sigh...

Shows how childish someone is...

Look at that amount of smilies.

LOOK! If you have something personal agaisnt me, flame me by using PM, but dont do it here.
Post 16 Apr 2005, 03:06
No flames here or by PM please. Keep it civil you two.
Post 08 May 2005, 02:54
Barbarossa would've begun one month earlier, and Yugoslavian troops would've participated. The Germans would also have had thirteen additional combat divisions available. Moscow would've likely been stormed and capture in 1941, and the German drive in southern Russia in 1942 would've succeeded. Baku would then be cut off from the USSR, making waging of modern war very, very difficult to say the least. By the end of 1943, most of European Russia would've been under the German jackboot. The question then is whether or not the Anglo-American alliance would've been willing to sacrifice the blood and treasure to defeat Germany (which they could have done--Germany would've had no hope whatsoever competing against American manufacturing output).
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